S1E6: It Starts with Us w. Carrie Gottschalk
Nebraska Extension Early Childhood Program Area-Emily Manning, Dr. Holly Hatton, Ingrid Lindal, Erin Kampbell, Linda Reddish, Katie Krause, and LaDonna Werth
Author
10/10/2023
Added
21
Plays
Description
In this episode, we interview Carrie Gottschalk, a licensed mental health professional with an early childhood clinical specialization. She talks about some of the challenging behaviors that providers and families often seek help with. Gottschalk also provides strategies for how to best approach these behaviors while remaining calm. It starts with us as caregivers and educators to help guide and support children as they navigate their emotions.
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Resources:
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CHIME- https://child.unl.edu/chime
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Circle of Security Parenting- https://www.necosp.org/
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Nebraska Children and Families Foundation -https://www.nebraskachildren.org/ .
Nebraska Resource Project for Vulnerable Young Children -https://www.nebraskababies.com/ .
The following music was used for this media project:
Music: Afterparty Review by Sascha Ende
Free download: https://filmmusic.io/song/2962-afterparty-review
License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license .
"Wholesome" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
Searchable Transcript
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- [00:00:00.514](electronic music)
- [00:00:10.080]This is "The Good Life in Early Life,"
- [00:00:13.110]a production of Nebraska Extension.
- [00:00:15.030]I'm your host, Emily Manning,
- [00:00:16.440]an early childhood extension educator in Seward County.
- [00:00:19.620]Our guest today is a licensed mental health therapist
- [00:00:22.200]with early childhood clinical specializations
- [00:00:24.630]in child-parent psychotherapy,
- [00:00:26.760]parent-child interaction therapy,
- [00:00:28.620]and teacher-child interaction training.
- [00:00:30.690]She has spent nearly 30 years in the fields of education
- [00:00:33.690]in mental and behavioral health working with children,
- [00:00:36.120]adolescents, and families.
- [00:00:37.470]Welcome to the show, Carrie Gottschalk!
- [00:00:39.960]Thanks for havin' me, Emily!
- [00:00:42.210]Looking forward to it.
- [00:00:43.470]Yeah!
- [00:00:44.303]We are so happy to have you on
- [00:00:45.547]"The Good Life in Early Life" today.
- [00:00:47.310]And if you've listened to the show before,
- [00:00:49.560]you may know that I always ask my guests about a funny story
- [00:00:52.980]about them or their favorite memory from their childhood,
- [00:00:56.220]but I thought that since today
- [00:00:57.450]we're talking about behaviors, I wanted to ask you,
- [00:01:00.630]what is a funny story about you misbehaving as a child,
- [00:01:04.590]or when was a time that you misbehaved,
- [00:01:07.650]and it was handled well by an adult?
- [00:01:09.900]I can think of very specific stories,
- [00:01:12.300]but they're all from adolescence,
- [00:01:14.220]and so I'm not really going back
- [00:01:15.840]back far enough to childhood,
- [00:01:17.310]but I don't have something specific.
- [00:01:19.590]But I can say that I was an incredibly dishonest child.
- [00:01:24.300]Really? (laughing)
- [00:01:25.800]I got in trouble all the time.
- [00:01:27.930]I do know that, I got in trouble all the,
- [00:01:29.850]that was probably the number one reason I got in trouble
- [00:01:31.860]the most frequently,
- [00:01:33.510]is because I was not
- [00:01:34.800]a particularly honest little person. (laughing)
- [00:01:37.675]Oh, okay!
- [00:01:39.454]So, there you go, that's me. (giggling)
- [00:01:41.040]Okay.
- [00:01:42.453]Well, I appreciate your honesty now.
- [00:01:43.620]Thanks for that.
- [00:01:44.610]Now, I wanted to share
- [00:01:45.990]mine with you, so- Please.
- [00:01:48.013]I also, I was ornery,
- [00:01:50.010]I just like to test boundaries when I was little,
- [00:01:53.100]so I was also in trouble a lot.
- [00:01:54.930]And in kindergarten especially,
- [00:01:57.120]I think I was having trouble transitioning into
- [00:01:59.460]the classroom setting, and I didn't have any siblings,
- [00:02:02.850]and so I'd never really shared with anyone.
- [00:02:05.160]And we were all sitting at circle tables,
- [00:02:08.040]and we had all of our supplies
- [00:02:10.290]out in the middle of the table.
- [00:02:11.670]That's not why I got in trouble but it's relevant later on.
- [00:02:15.150]I got in trouble for talking too much.
- [00:02:17.010]And talking too often,
- [00:02:18.510]and so my kindergarten teacher moved me
- [00:02:20.820]to my own little desk facing the wall,
- [00:02:23.040]and I got to have all of my supplies right there,
- [00:02:25.950]I didn't have to share them with anyone.
- [00:02:27.720]And I was just loving it. (Carrie laughing)
- [00:02:28.833]When my grandma came for grandparent's day,
- [00:02:31.470]and she was livid that I was sitting by myself,
- [00:02:34.560]so she talked to my teacher, and then my teacher was like,
- [00:02:37.657]"Okay, Emily, we'll give you a second chance
- [00:02:39.990]to be back in, like, with everybody else,
- [00:02:42.270]you just have to not talk."
- [00:02:44.649](Carrie laughing)
- [00:02:45.482]And here I am, I'm like,
- [00:02:46.315]"Well, I don't wanna go back to this table!"
- [00:02:48.360]I'm like, "You just gave me a recipe
- [00:02:50.070]for how I'm gonna get myself back to my nice little desk,"
- [00:02:52.590]and so- Absolutely!
- [00:02:54.400](Emily chuckling)
- [00:02:55.233]That's exactly what I did.
- [00:02:56.066]I just like started talking immediately.
- [00:02:57.510]I don't even think it was a day,
- [00:02:58.500]and I was back at my desk.
- [00:03:00.630]Ah.
- [00:03:01.463]So, I'm sorry,
- [00:03:02.296]Mrs. Galbot- Love it.
- [00:03:03.129]Sorry you had to put up with me,
- [00:03:03.962]I know I was a lot, (Carrie chuckling)
- [00:03:04.800]but I straightened out in the end.
- [00:03:06.877](both laughing)
- [00:03:08.663]But honestly, like you said, pushing boundaries,
- [00:03:10.170]and those, smart, feisty, honorary ones, OMG!
- [00:03:13.530]Like, that's good stuff!
- [00:03:15.330]You just shape it, that turns into adult
- [00:03:17.400]good stuff. (laughing)
- [00:03:18.233]Oh, that's (voice drowns in connectivity issue)
- [00:03:19.723](both laughing)
- [00:03:20.556]That's good, yeah.
- [00:03:21.763]That's wonderful- So, there's hope
- [00:03:22.710]for those feisty ones.
- [00:03:24.090]100%, those are our leaders, absolutely.
- [00:03:27.118](Emily laughing)
- [00:03:27.951]Oh, that's so fun.
- [00:03:28.830]But let's get into some of our questions for today.
- [00:03:31.470]So, with your work as a therapist,
- [00:03:33.420]and previously in your role as an extension educator,
- [00:03:36.060]you've helped with behaviors for many years.
- [00:03:38.490]What are the most common behaviors that you've been sought
- [00:03:41.490]to help with for young children
- [00:03:43.260]between birth to the age of eight?
- [00:03:44.880]Yeah, you know what?
- [00:03:45.713]When I thought about this,
- [00:03:46.650]I started kind of just listing them off,
- [00:03:48.240]and it's the obvious ones, like, okay,
- [00:03:50.280]kids who don't listen,
- [00:03:51.420]kids who limit tasks, kids who have temper tantrums,
- [00:03:54.930]kids who maybe have some either verbal
- [00:03:56.850]or physical aggression.
- [00:03:58.650]We go to bedtime routine,
- [00:04:00.240]kids who don't wanna sleep in their own bed,
- [00:04:01.830]mealtime kids who don't wanna (laughing) sit at the table,
- [00:04:03.870]like, it's all the kinda quote, unquote,
- [00:04:06.030]maybe typical ones or common ones.
- [00:04:08.580]And in all sincerity,
- [00:04:09.900]I like to just bucket these into two,
- [00:04:11.880]they're two giant buckets,
- [00:04:13.050]and we'll kind of reference it as we continue talking.
- [00:04:15.870]But there's the bucket of not following directions,
- [00:04:18.810]or maybe we could call it the bucket of compliance.
- [00:04:21.390]And I don't want compliance to be like misinterpreted,
- [00:04:24.510]like I mean little robot children, but I mean,
- [00:04:27.930]time to come inside or time to turn the TV off,
- [00:04:30.360]or last cookie, or get your jammies on,
- [00:04:33.540]like that's compliance-related,
- [00:04:35.400]following adult directions, or following the routine.
- [00:04:38.550]And then, there's the temper tantrum bucket,
- [00:04:40.800]which can be interpreted lots of different ways,
- [00:04:42.900]but that's really just emotion.
- [00:04:44.790]That's emotional regulation.
- [00:04:46.050]So, there's the compliance bucket
- [00:04:47.940]and the emotional regulation bucket.
- [00:04:49.710]Can I handle big feelings?
- [00:04:51.000]And when I am having big feelings, what do they look like?
- [00:04:53.370]So, that might've been- And so,
- [00:04:54.203]Too much. (laughing)
- [00:04:55.200]You've seen those common themes
- [00:04:56.610]with behaviors- Oh!
- [00:04:57.690]Always. (chuckling)
- [00:04:58.530]Yeah.
- [00:04:59.778]And so, they can mostly fall in within those categories.
- [00:05:02.070]Always, absolutely.
- [00:05:03.330]It's always about compliance or emotional regulation.
- [00:05:06.720]Yep! (chuckling)
- [00:05:07.553]Yeah!
- [00:05:08.819]So, just thinking about parents and educators,
- [00:05:11.040]what role do their relationships with the children play
- [00:05:15.240]into guiding behavior and helping with behavior?
- [00:05:18.240]When we think about those two buckets,
- [00:05:20.490]those two themes of compliance
- [00:05:22.230]and emotion regulation.
- [00:05:24.330]There's a little kind of catchphrase,
- [00:05:26.130]and I cannot remember it exactly how I want,
- [00:05:29.340]and I've been thinking on it, in a nutshell,
- [00:05:31.800]it's behavior change, behavior guidance, whatever,
- [00:05:35.610]and I'll even talk about why I say whatever
- [00:05:37.890]'cause sometimes, we like, what do we even wanna call this?
- [00:05:40.950]It actually happens,
- [00:05:42.240]it unfolds, it grows within the context of a relationship.
- [00:05:47.160]So if I say behavior guidance,
- [00:05:49.650]I kind of actually think about growing little humans!
- [00:05:52.530]Like, I mean,
- [00:05:53.730]we start little tiny people,
- [00:05:55.440]and we grow up to be big people,
- [00:05:57.390]and there's a whole bunch to learn in that process.
- [00:05:59.430]And behaviors are just, well, everything we do!
- [00:06:02.610]I mean, (laughing).
- [00:06:04.020]And so, as we're shaping ourselves to be good humans,
- [00:06:08.160]if we wanna call that behavior guidance, sure we can,
- [00:06:10.920]but that actually all unfolds
- [00:06:12.900]within the context of relationship.
- [00:06:15.450]It's at the center of everything we're talking about.
- [00:06:17.310]So, it sounds like relationships are really critical
- [00:06:20.970]for guiding behaviors and helping that little human
- [00:06:25.260]develop and grow into who they're going to be.
- [00:06:27.720]Can you gimme some concrete examples of what
- [00:06:29.850]that might look like?
- [00:06:30.960]Yes.
- [00:06:31.793]So, something else to keep in mind as we're thinking
- [00:06:35.070]about that, is we are the most experienced dependent species
- [00:06:40.470]on the planet.
- [00:06:41.430]And so, when we are born,
- [00:06:43.800]we are equipped with much more of that reptilian brain,
- [00:06:47.580]and we are equipped with our DNA and our temperament,
- [00:06:51.210]and some other really good things.
- [00:06:52.620]But as we know, they are 100% dependent on
- [00:06:57.210]an adult caregiver for an excessive amount of time.
- [00:07:01.950]Not just 12 months,
- [00:07:04.500]but years and years and years, and years.
- [00:07:06.630]And so, when I say behavior,
- [00:07:08.970]like really unfolds within the context of a relationship,
- [00:07:11.940]it's this amazing dance back and forth.
- [00:07:15.450]We call it serve and return,
- [00:07:16.980]where something happens in, one person does something,
- [00:07:20.280]the other person mimics, repeats, responds.
- [00:07:23.280]And so, there's this relational dance that happens
- [00:07:26.400]between babies and adults.
- [00:07:28.890]And so, as we are helping them
- [00:07:30.570]grow socially and emotionally,
- [00:07:32.550]it's actually all building upon itself,
- [00:07:35.760]and every experience leads to another experience,
- [00:07:38.220]and every connection leads to another connection.
- [00:07:41.100]And so, it's just, it's never simple.
- [00:07:43.620]But so. again, when we go back to shaping behavior,
- [00:07:46.410]and you say a concrete example,
- [00:07:48.330]it happens within the context of a relationship.
- [00:07:50.580]So if I don't have a relationship at all
- [00:07:53.250]with a little tiny person, let's make them
- [00:07:55.530]less than tiny, let's say they're two or three,
- [00:07:57.690]and I just approach them and reprimand them
- [00:08:00.480]for doing something
- [00:08:01.313]that they should be not doing, let's pretend.
- [00:08:04.080]There's an entire plethora of things
- [00:08:06.930]that brought that child to be like in a position
- [00:08:09.720]to maybe respond or not respond to me.
- [00:08:12.150]They could cower, they could cry,
- [00:08:14.310]they could lash out, they could run away, they could comply.
- [00:08:17.820]I mean, it's a bazillion things.
- [00:08:20.160]So, just because I'm an adult,
- [00:08:22.050]and just because I go over to Michael,
- [00:08:23.550]and I say, "Michael, stop hitting Timmy,"
- [00:08:25.440]it does not mean Michael's gonna comply
- [00:08:27.180]and stop hitting Timmy because there's like no context
- [00:08:30.390]for him to be, yeah, I mean, he's spent three years
- [00:08:33.510]trying to figure this game out,
- [00:08:34.890]and so there's a whole host of reasons
- [00:08:36.450]why he may or may not respond.
- [00:08:37.980]And a bazillion reasons
- [00:08:39.120]as to how he could respond! (chuckling)
- [00:08:41.126]I don't know, I don't know if that went too,
- [00:08:41.970]if that was too vague.
- [00:08:42.803]No, I think that was like
- [00:08:43.680]a great example of how complicated behaviors are.
- [00:08:47.370]And there's not just like a silver bullet
- [00:08:49.800]for figuring out a person's behavior,
- [00:08:52.320]like, you really need to understand their context,
- [00:08:54.210]you need to understand the relationships
- [00:08:55.920]that they're surrounded by.
- [00:08:57.480]So, when you're helping guide behaviors,
- [00:09:00.750]or when you're helping a parent or an educator
- [00:09:02.880]with a challenging behavior,
- [00:09:05.190]it's not gonna be a simple solution necessarily.
- [00:09:08.460]Is that kind of what I'm hearing?
- [00:09:10.320]Yeah, yeah! Absolutely, absolutely.
- [00:09:12.270]It's very individualized as it should be.
- [00:09:14.310]It needs to be individualized,
- [00:09:15.720]and so it's not a, there's not a canned answer
- [00:09:18.840]to give to anybody for any one thing.
- [00:09:21.120]And so, you've been helping educators
- [00:09:23.430]and parents a lot with behaviors.
- [00:09:25.740]And so, one of my questions for you was,
- [00:09:27.870]what is one of the most difficult
- [00:09:29.460]aspects of helping parents with behaviors?
- [00:09:32.400]I'm kinda guessing it might be that it's not simple.
- [00:09:35.640]Right, absolutely.
- [00:09:36.690]I would say, first and foremost,
- [00:09:38.820]it's misunderstanding and misinformation.
- [00:09:41.490]We have unfortunately not done a phenomenal job of, like,
- [00:09:45.840]we've made a lot of missteps,
- [00:09:47.040]and when I say we, I mean like human beings.
- [00:09:49.050]We've had a lot of missteps along the way.
- [00:09:51.450]And a lot of very significant misunderstanding
- [00:09:54.840]about how children should be raised,
- [00:09:56.460]and what we should be doing.
- [00:09:59.040]And it's unfortunate.
- [00:09:59.910]And so, there's still a lot of misinformation
- [00:10:01.770]and misunderstanding out there.
- [00:10:03.330]So that definitely plays a part in helping parents,
- [00:10:06.870]because we have to first just kind of be honest about that,
- [00:10:10.290]and kind of sift through that a bit.
- [00:10:12.780]And then, also the second misnomer is that adults should,
- [00:10:16.350]like, this should be innate.
- [00:10:17.460]Parenting should be something that I just know how to do.
- [00:10:21.240]And so, shame on me for having to ask for help
- [00:10:23.430]or having to ask other people.
- [00:10:25.710]I should know how to do this.
- [00:10:27.120]Eh, no, no, no, no.
- [00:10:28.470]That's a huge misunderstanding.
- [00:10:30.030]And so, those two, first and foremost, and then, yes,
- [00:10:33.570]Emily, you were correct.
- [00:10:34.500]The third one would be, every situation is unique!
- [00:10:36.960]And so, there's always more to talk about
- [00:10:38.700]before we decide what's the right response
- [00:10:41.340]for that family, that situation.
- [00:10:42.930]I love that.
- [00:10:43.763]Thanks Carrie, for sharing that.
- [00:10:44.880]And then, you've also worked with educators as well.
- [00:10:47.880]What's maybe difficult working with educators
- [00:10:50.610]when they seek help with behaviors?
- [00:10:52.560]Same.
- [00:10:53.460]I'll be a little bit of a broken record.
- [00:10:55.560]It's misinformation, misunderstanding.
- [00:10:58.050]Thinking that because they are professionals in this arena,
- [00:11:00.780]they should know how to do it.
- [00:11:02.220]And making the assumption that it worked for Michael,
- [00:11:05.400]why isn't it working for Sarah?
- [00:11:07.110]And that's a bummer, because I might have been
- [00:11:11.280]in this profession for 20 years.
- [00:11:13.260]And I might have been doing it this way,
- [00:11:15.150]and it's incredibly successful.
- [00:11:16.680]And yet, it does not mean that every child who comes to us
- [00:11:20.730]is in the same and right place,
- [00:11:22.680]the same place to be able to be receiving.
- [00:11:25.084]And so, it's kinda like, no, we have to be open to change.
- [00:11:26.910]We can't always fit little people into our box.
- [00:11:29.790]We have to be okay changing and being flexible. (chuckling)
- [00:11:33.900]Which can be hard because educators are stressed,
- [00:11:37.500]they have a lot on their plate.
- [00:11:40.050]And I think it can be frustrating
- [00:11:42.300]if you were an educator, and you're like,
- [00:11:43.710]I know that this technique has worked in the past,
- [00:11:45.870]why won't it work again, you know? (chuckling)
- [00:11:48.417]100%- So, just thinking about them
- [00:11:49.800]and being compassionate to the situation
- [00:11:51.630]that they are in as well.
- [00:11:53.456]Well, and then add to that.
- [00:11:54.450]You mean, what makes that situation even more unique
- [00:11:57.180]is the ratio.
- [00:11:58.410]I mean, I am thinking about a toddler classroom
- [00:12:01.200]that potentially could have 2 adults and 12 toddlers.
- [00:12:05.280]This isn't a ratio soapbox, but I could make it one.
- [00:12:08.286](both laughing)
- [00:12:10.041]And so, that's a different podcast.
- [00:12:14.132](Emily laughing)
- [00:12:15.120]But and so, yeah, when you say having compassion,
- [00:12:17.250]it's like, a parent who's navigating multiple ages,
- [00:12:20.250]and the stress of maybe a full-time job,
- [00:12:21.990]or maybe being home with their children all day,
- [00:12:23.910]or whatever that looks like, a single parent, someone else
- [00:12:27.090]in the situation who can help, two parents not parenting
- [00:12:29.910]the same way, I mean, all the complexity.
- [00:12:31.920]But then yeah, go to educators, it's like, well,
- [00:12:33.990]I've got either multiple ages if I'm home-based,
- [00:12:36.120]or if I'm center-based, I've got 12, 3, and 4-year-olds.
- [00:12:39.930]And so, that individualization,
- [00:12:42.300]that's asking a lot of people.
- [00:12:43.950]Absolutely, that's.
- [00:12:44.910]So, I think, takeaway would be like,
- [00:12:46.980]have grace (chuckling)
- [00:12:48.630]for yourself- Oh, shh.
- [00:12:50.576]This is not easy. (chuckling)
- [00:12:51.698]No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
- [00:12:53.830]Yeah, you're right, I mean, no, it's not easy,
- [00:12:55.680]and have grace and compassion.
- [00:12:56.910]And yet , the reason I'm kind of pausing
- [00:12:58.980]is because I wanna figure out the right way to say this,
- [00:13:02.010]so I'm gonna kind of pause for a minute.
- [00:13:04.710]It's complicated, but it's not hard.
- [00:13:07.830]And I know that that sounds confusing
- [00:13:09.570]'cause there's a saying out there right,
- [00:13:10.920]where we say it's actually, it's, I don't know,
- [00:13:14.610]what is the saying?
- [00:13:15.443]"It's simple but not easy or it's easy, but not simple."
- [00:13:17.610]This situation, I wanna say, yes, it's complicated.
- [00:13:21.930]But it's honestly not hard.
- [00:13:24.330]And that's strange for me to say that.
- [00:13:27.450]I'm gonna say something, and correct me if that's wrong,
- [00:13:30.060]but it's complicated because we have to individualize it
- [00:13:33.240]to that child and the specific behavior
- [00:13:35.550]that we're trying to work on or develop.
- [00:13:38.790]But yet, the strategies that we use to help that child,
- [00:13:41.910]to teach them behaviors to replace the behavior
- [00:13:45.870]can be simple to implement.
- [00:13:47.460]It's just figuring out what works for that child,
- [00:13:50.130]maybe what's the root cause of the behavior,
- [00:13:52.380]that can be what is complex.
- [00:13:54.330]Yeah, yeah, yeah!
- [00:13:56.130]I mean, really, yeah, they're little people.
- [00:13:58.080]They're two and three years old, the four and five,
- [00:13:59.700]I mean, trust me, I've worked with them for years,
- [00:14:01.440]I get how challenging it can be,
- [00:14:02.820]and I'm not minimizing it at all.
- [00:14:04.710]But yes, once you kind of frame it differently for yourself,
- [00:14:08.220]then all of a sudden it becomes, sure,
- [00:14:09.510]it becomes a little complicated, but it's really not.
- [00:14:13.260]It's really not hard work, because they're quite adaptable,
- [00:14:17.010]those little guys. (chuckling)
- [00:14:18.120]They really are.
- [00:14:19.349](Carrie laughing)
- [00:14:20.182]They're awesome, I love 'em.
- [00:14:22.006]They're great.
- [00:14:23.100]They teach us just as much as- Oh, yeah.
- [00:14:25.349]We teach them, I think.
- [00:14:26.182]What are the top three things that you want parents
- [00:14:28.380]and educators to know about behavior guidance?
- [00:14:30.780]And so, specifically, when we're thinking about
- [00:14:33.300]behaviors that challenge us.
- [00:14:34.830]Yeah.
- [00:14:35.663]And thanks for framing it like that.
- [00:14:37.380]So, let's just talk about like behaviors that challenge us.
- [00:14:39.630]Behaviors that really are hot buttons for me,
- [00:14:41.520]or that kind of activate,
- [00:14:43.290]or get a response or reaction out of me.
- [00:14:46.440]100$%, first and foremost,
- [00:14:48.420]I wanna be kind and compassionate when I say this,
- [00:14:51.060]but it's not about you.
- [00:14:52.560]It's never been about you.
- [00:14:54.240]And so, when you have,
- [00:14:56.130]let's say a one-year-old who's biting,
- [00:14:58.080]a two-year-old who's tantruming,
- [00:14:59.670]a three-year-old who's being dishonest and lying,
- [00:15:01.980]or hitting his or her friends,
- [00:15:03.750]those behaviors do challenge us.
- [00:15:06.390]They cause an emotional, physical reaction in us,
- [00:15:09.720]we have feelings about them.
- [00:15:11.160]But my number one thing I want parents and teachers
- [00:15:13.860]to understand, it's never been about you.
- [00:15:15.840]It's not about you.
- [00:15:16.920]No little person wakes up in the morning and thinks
- [00:15:19.560]to themselves, how can I make Carrie miserable today?
- [00:15:23.010]Like, that's not in their cognitive development ever, ever.
- [00:15:27.630]They're egocentric, don't get me wrong.
- [00:15:29.430]It's quite egocentric,
- [00:15:30.960]but it has nothing to do with malicious intent. (chuckling)
- [00:15:33.930]Right.
- [00:15:34.763]That's number one.
- [00:15:35.640]Like, that's my go-to framing,
- [00:15:37.920]it's not about me, it's not about me, it's not about me.
- [00:15:39.540]It's because it's not.
- [00:15:40.380]It's never been like, how can I really get carried today,
- [00:15:43.980]it's egocentric thought- Right.
- [00:15:45.870]Right, and I can even go back to the example
- [00:15:47.580]that I shared earlier, at the beginning of the podcast
- [00:15:50.490]where I talked about being in kindergarten.
- [00:15:53.040]And so, I was misbehaving, like a goal that I wanted.
- [00:15:57.900]So, I wanted to be at my desk in my situation,
- [00:16:01.500]so I knew that acting a certain way would get me that,
- [00:16:04.080]not because I was trying to make somebody's day, like awful.
- [00:16:07.410]Exactly- It was because
- [00:16:08.243]I wanted something.
- [00:16:09.180]Perfect! It was egocentric!
- [00:16:10.740]And it was appropriate! It was age appropriate!
- [00:16:13.984]Right!
- [00:16:14.817]That's exactly! You're like, shh!
- [00:16:15.650]I get my own desk, I get my own supplies,
- [00:16:17.610]are you kidding me? (Emily chuckling)
- [00:16:18.660]Right!
- [00:16:19.923]And so yeah,
- [00:16:20.756]it's never about disrespect the teacher,
- [00:16:21.589]or trying to one up mom or dad,
- [00:16:23.370]not when they're that young, absolutely not.
- [00:16:25.230]My second would be something I already said,
- [00:16:27.877]"We are the most experienced dependent species
- [00:16:30.600]on the planet."
- [00:16:31.620]We require guidance, we require instruction,
- [00:16:35.010]and we require support.
- [00:16:36.510]And this is entirely 100%
- [00:16:38.370]within that realm of social and emotional skills.
- [00:16:41.370]So, when I say following directions, being patient,
- [00:16:45.270]waiting your turn, staying on task, following a routine,
- [00:16:49.530]taking turns, those are social skills.
- [00:16:52.140]And then, we go into emotions like managing disappointment,
- [00:16:55.200]accepting a no answer, and being okay being sad.
- [00:16:58.470]Like having a feeling like angry as every human
- [00:17:02.220]on the planet has the right to feel,
- [00:17:04.020]what do I do with anger?
- [00:17:05.220]How do I express it?
- [00:17:06.300]How do I manage it?
- [00:17:07.470]That's like tip number two is, we have to learn that!
- [00:17:11.520]And when we stop and think about how many adults
- [00:17:14.580]maybe aren't that great at some of the things I just listed,
- [00:17:17.490]like think about waiting in line at McDonald's
- [00:17:19.320]or Target, and how impatient we can get,
- [00:17:21.090]and how rude people can be, and those are grownups.
- [00:17:23.460]Or, think about like taking turns and sharing,
- [00:17:26.310]like with grownups in terms of navigating a team,
- [00:17:31.200]and everyone wanting to have access
- [00:17:32.820]to the supplies, or I mean, like,
- [00:17:34.650]these are transferable skills,
- [00:17:36.120]or like accepting disappointment,
- [00:17:37.380]you ask your boss for something,
- [00:17:38.550]and he or she has to say no.
- [00:17:40.500]We have feelings, we get disappointed,
- [00:17:42.060]we get angry, we get sad.
- [00:17:43.320]And so I'm like, "Okay, these are little tiny people,
- [00:17:45.690]and they're not good at it yet." (chuckling)
- [00:17:48.830]Haha!
- [00:17:49.663]So that's my tip number two, they need our support.
- [00:17:51.510]And then, my tip number three would be like,
- [00:17:53.610]be open to learning.
- [00:17:54.840]Because there's always, always, always something
- [00:17:57.420]to be learned.
- [00:17:58.350]And so, as an adult, be open to doing different.
- [00:18:01.500]You have to be calm to bring calm.
- [00:18:03.030]Like you have to possess- Oh, I love that, Carrie.
- [00:18:05.160]I love that Carrie- Yeah.
- [00:18:06.604](Emily chuckling)
- [00:18:07.437]You have to possess calm to share calm,
- [00:18:08.520]you have be calm to bring calm.
- [00:18:11.490]Love it, great advice.
- [00:18:13.230]Great advice for parents and educators out there.
- [00:18:15.240]So, what is your like top favorite behavior guidance tool
- [00:18:19.140]or tip of all time?
- [00:18:21.120]If I have emotionally dysregulated
- [00:18:23.100]little people around me,
- [00:18:24.540]they are dependent on my co-regulation.
- [00:18:27.450]And these are like I know, kind of like,
- [00:18:29.160]therapy, sciencey words that often parents
- [00:18:31.890]don't talk about, like this idea of like, co-regulate, or.
- [00:18:35.820]But I will say, that if I have a temper-tantruming,
- [00:18:39.510]two or three-year-old, they require co-regulation.
- [00:18:43.200]They are not designed to self-regulate yet.
- [00:18:48.030]We download that into them.
- [00:18:49.740]We actually outsource, Tiffany Fay is a a neurologist,
- [00:18:53.040]and she's got a lovely TEDx Talk on this,
- [00:18:55.350]I should share it, it's like 10 minutes.
- [00:18:57.210]And I love how she says, "They outsource it.
- [00:19:00.240]We download our calm into them."
- [00:19:03.600]And that's actually how we are designed as human species.
- [00:19:07.749]And this happens for years, three years, maybe four,
- [00:19:10.080]maybe five, depending on the child's temperament,
- [00:19:12.150]depending on the life situation, circumstances, DNA,
- [00:19:14.760]all the things.
- [00:19:15.750]And so, you have to outsource that to them.
- [00:19:18.870]You have to co-regulate.
- [00:19:20.160]And one of the missteps we've taken for so long
- [00:19:23.370]was this whole idea of timeout.
- [00:19:25.860]And it was well-intended, don't get me wrong,
- [00:19:27.900]like it was super well-intended.
- [00:19:29.280]And I totally get that
- [00:19:30.750]the individuals who promoted it and shared it,
- [00:19:33.060]and talked about it meant well.
- [00:19:34.710]And yet, a two or three-year-old
- [00:19:37.350]isn't designed to be able to self-regulate.
- [00:19:40.320]So if they're already emotionally distressed,
- [00:19:42.090]and then we separate their co-regulator from them,
- [00:19:45.060]and put them somewhere alone and ask them to self-regulate,
- [00:19:49.560]which is a skill maybe they haven't acquired already anyway,
- [00:19:51.720]especially if they're having an emotional,
- [00:19:53.610]like temper tantrum.
- [00:19:54.960]We've just actually upped their distress,
- [00:19:57.120]which is oftentimes why you'll hear parents
- [00:19:58.950]and providers say something like,
- [00:20:00.457]"Well, they were temper tantruming, and like,
- [00:20:02.520]they had to sit on the step or a chair,
- [00:20:04.350]or I put 'em in the corner,
- [00:20:05.520]I put 'em in the room, and they lost it.
- [00:20:07.140]Like, they went nuts and started throwing things,
- [00:20:08.850]and they became even worse."
- [00:20:10.380]Well, yeah, they became panicked.
- [00:20:12.570]They became panicked because they lost
- [00:20:14.160]their source of co-regulation.
- [00:20:15.840]And that's a misunderstanding as well.
- [00:20:17.550]That's just genuine misunderstanding misinformation, so.
- [00:20:21.115]So, that's kind of always my go-to is, it starts with us.
- [00:20:25.890]I guess maybe I'll change it to the end.
- [00:20:27.150]you gotta be calm to bring calm,
- [00:20:28.410]hey, it starts with us. (laughing)
- [00:20:29.700]Yeah. (laughing)
- [00:20:31.200]Starts with us.
- [00:20:32.033]I really love the idea of like downloading calm,
- [00:20:34.860]like I don't, in my head,
- [00:20:36.060]it's such a good visual image of like passing your calm
- [00:20:39.450]into the kid.
- [00:20:40.290]And so, when I think of that,
- [00:20:41.970]I also think of when I've dealt with behaviors
- [00:20:44.850]that push my hot buttons as an educator.
- [00:20:47.370]And so, it can be challenging to remain calm
- [00:20:51.660]when we have those hot buttons pushed by behaviors.
- [00:20:55.410]So, what is some advice for parents and educators
- [00:20:59.370]on how to remain calm in those challenging moments?
- [00:21:02.610]So, I will offer two things.
- [00:21:04.920]One would be a reminder that good enough is good enough.
- [00:21:09.150]Circle security parenting has a phrase
- [00:21:11.400]they call "Good enough parenting."
- [00:21:13.290]God bless them.
- [00:21:14.280]Nobody's asking anybody to be perfect.
- [00:21:16.260]And the science tells us that,
- [00:21:17.820]but nobody's asking anyone to be perfect.
- [00:21:19.680]And so if you did lose your temper, and you did yell
- [00:21:23.190]something like "Knock it off, or "Stop it,"
- [00:21:26.896]and maybe you don't like how you responded that time,
- [00:21:29.580]a lot of grace, a lot of self-compassion.
- [00:21:31.410]We also call it rupture and repair.
- [00:21:33.180]It's like, yeah, you know what, we're humans.
- [00:21:35.340]No one's (Emily chuckling)
- [00:21:36.330]attempting to be perfect.
- [00:21:37.440]So, we all get the opportunity to be able to repair
- [00:21:40.500]every rupture that happens, so that's number one.
- [00:21:43.170]Number two, when I say good enough is good enough,
- [00:21:45.510]means you don't have to be perfect 100% of the time,
- [00:21:47.910]so every time you've got a kiddo
- [00:21:49.230]who's really distressed or pushing your buttons,
- [00:21:52.140]sometimes you can be present, and you can co-regulate,
- [00:21:54.900]and sometimes we know you can't.
- [00:21:57.180]And kids are pretty, they're pretty resilient.
- [00:22:01.057]And so sometimes, you need a break,
- [00:22:03.150]you need a mom break, a dad break, a parent break,
- [00:22:04.813]a teacher break.
- [00:22:06.293]And so, it's like maybe they are gonna have
- [00:22:07.126]a little bit of a time where you need to do
- [00:22:08.550]your own calm down
- [00:22:09.750]in order for you (Emily chuckling)
- [00:22:10.583]to be calm, to bring calm.
- [00:22:11.940]And that's okay too.
- [00:22:13.140]Yeah, transfer the timeouts to the adults,
- [00:22:15.000]not the kids (chuckling)- Uh-huh, for sure, for sure.
- [00:22:17.340]There's a little pacing and walking, breathing.
- [00:22:19.740]And then, that leads me to my third one is,
- [00:22:22.710]really, this all builds to say, "Okay, here's my self-talk."
- [00:22:25.440]And my self-talk goes back to,
- [00:22:27.007]"It's not about me, they're kids."
- [00:22:30.252]I mean, like, somebody might talk to me
- [00:22:31.085]about a five-year-old, and I am never intending
- [00:22:33.360]to be insulting to the five-year-old,
- [00:22:35.190]but my brain goes, "He's a baby!"
- [00:22:37.560]Because think about it, I'm 50.
- [00:22:39.120]So, I mean, think about it, a five-year old?
- [00:22:40.710]He's a baby!
- [00:22:42.120]He's an itty bitty!
- [00:22:43.740](Emily chuckling) Now, granted,
- [00:22:44.573]he's in kindergarten and he's playing soccer,
- [00:22:47.280]and he's helping his three-year-old sister,
- [00:22:49.290]and so maybe in your eyes, you're thinking he's a big.
- [00:22:52.530]But in the big scheme of things.
- [00:22:55.170]He's a baby.
- [00:22:56.742](both laughing)
- [00:22:58.389]And so, my self-talk is always,
- [00:23:00.584]"It's not about me, and he's a baby, or she's a baby."
- [00:23:03.360]And that's not ever meant to insult a child.
- [00:23:05.850]That's to remind me who they are and the place
- [00:23:08.970]in their life that they're in.
- [00:23:10.290]You know what I mean- Right.
- [00:23:11.820]So, yeah.
- [00:23:12.653]That makes me think of that viral video
- [00:23:14.790]where they're like, "I'm just a baby."
- [00:23:17.242](both laughing)
- [00:23:18.120]I dunno if you've seen that, Carrie.
- [00:23:20.378]Oh, Emily, I say that all the time.
- [00:23:22.396]"I'm just a baby!
- [00:23:23.652]Just a baby. (chuckling)
- [00:23:24.485]Just a baby.
- [00:23:25.318](Emily chuckling)
- [00:23:26.151]Because she is! She's a baby!
- [00:23:28.081](Emily laughing)
- [00:23:28.977]Yeah, she is. (chuckling)
- [00:23:31.080]Anyway, so sweet, so sweet.
- [00:23:33.180]Good tips, and good reminders
- [00:23:35.970]that we don't always have to be perfect,
- [00:23:37.860]which can ease some anxiety in parents and educators,
- [00:23:40.800]and that kids are resilient.
- [00:23:42.720]So, as long as we're there for them
- [00:23:44.760]and we're trying our best,
- [00:23:46.140]they're gonna be okay. (chuckling)
- [00:23:47.370]Yes, yes, absolutely- Kids are gonna be okay.
- [00:23:50.206]Yeah, yeah.
- [00:23:51.039]So, when should a parent seek professional help
- [00:23:55.290]for behavior guidance?
- [00:23:56.820]So, I just want to really say
- [00:24:00.420]it's always better sooner rather than later.
- [00:24:03.870]And I know that that, like for example,
- [00:24:06.540]going to the dentist, (laughing)
- [00:24:09.270]we go every six months or every year
- [00:24:11.730]to get your teeth cleaned,
- [00:24:12.840]to be very preventative because we don't want
- [00:24:15.210]to end up filling cavities.
- [00:24:16.650]And so, I get like,
- [00:24:18.090]I'm not saying every person should run out and seek therapy,
- [00:24:20.820]I don't mean to imply that.
- [00:24:22.140]I just mean, you don't have to wait until there's a problem.
- [00:24:25.380]Like, you really don't have to wait
- [00:24:27.060]until it's a cavity to go seek quote, unquote
- [00:24:29.670]professional help or some type of guidance.
- [00:24:32.040]And that might mean listening to podcasts,
- [00:24:34.860]reading books, attending a parenting class,
- [00:24:37.590]watching YouTube videos.
- [00:24:38.820]Like, there's a lot of ways to kind of quote, unquote
- [00:24:41.520]seek professional help.
- [00:24:42.570]And so, that's how, like I framed that question
- [00:24:44.940]in that bucket to be like,
- [00:24:45.773]shh, always, always seek professional help,
- [00:24:47.850]thank you very much.
- [00:24:48.984](both laughing)
- [00:24:49.817]You know what I mean?
- [00:24:50.650]There's lots out there, go get it!
- [00:24:51.483]There's a whole bunch out there,
- [00:24:52.830]by all means, like parenting is not innate.
- [00:24:56.239]It is not innate, it is not.
- [00:24:59.610]We learn this stuff.
- [00:25:01.829]And so, I really want to like normalize that.
- [00:25:03.630]To be like, yeah!
- [00:25:04.680]And as lovely as our parents are and our neighbors,
- [00:25:08.490]and our grandparents, and our siblings,
- [00:25:10.530]they're probably not experts either!
- [00:25:12.120]And I mean, maybe they are, maybe you've got
- [00:25:13.620]an expert in the family,
- [00:25:14.640]but yeah, (Emily laughing)
- [00:25:15.473]I would say sooner rather than later. (chuckling)
- [00:25:18.120]Yeah!
- [00:25:18.953]Before it's a problem. (chuckling)
- [00:25:20.010]Yeah, before it's a problem, yeah.
- [00:25:22.900]Reach out to those professional sources.
- [00:25:23.970]Where could they go?
- [00:25:24.990]Where are some places that you would refer them to?
- [00:25:28.050]I tell you what, Nebraska's just like a lovely, lovely,
- [00:25:30.480]like, we have this mantra, "It came out of Buffet."
- [00:25:32.760]It was like,
- [00:25:34.225]we want Nebraska to be the very best place to be a baby.
- [00:25:36.180]And like, we are so blessed to be here in Nebraska
- [00:25:39.120]because there are so many people who are amazing at this,
- [00:25:41.670]they're gifted at this, they do this.
- [00:25:43.560]And there are so many resources that we just don't talk
- [00:25:45.990]about enough, and we don't elevate enough.
- [00:25:48.060]One would be, I had to do a shout out to
- [00:25:50.190]the local Nebraska extension office.
- [00:25:52.770]So, big shout out to the child.unl.eduteam,
- [00:25:55.770]because they are a hands down resource in every community
- [00:25:59.460]across the state.
- [00:26:00.480]There is an early childhood educator team across the state
- [00:26:04.080]that focuses on birth to eight!
- [00:26:06.300]And there are just some amazing resources for professionals
- [00:26:09.990]as well as parents,
- [00:26:11.280]I just, like number one, provider resources we offer,
- [00:26:14.820]we extension, you guys, Emily,
- [00:26:17.100]offer so many wonderful resources for professionals,
- [00:26:20.250]early childhood professionals and providers, and teachers
- [00:26:22.350]to get in-service learning ongoing CEU learning units.
- [00:26:26.190]But then also, like a shout out to Chime,
- [00:26:28.620]absolutely love that program,
- [00:26:29.970]it's a mindfulness-based program.
- [00:26:32.190]It is offered for early childhood professionals,
- [00:26:34.410]as well as families.
- [00:26:35.970]And so, you can do a Google search
- [00:26:37.680]at the child.unl.edu site, and look for Chime.
- [00:26:40.590]A second amazing, amazing resource that we have
- [00:26:44.070]is called Circle Security Parenting,
- [00:26:45.750]I referenced it earlier in the podcast.
- [00:26:47.730]So, you can search for necosp.org,
- [00:26:50.790]which is nebraskacirclesecurityparenting.org,
- [00:26:53.280]so necoosp.org, check them out, and find a COSP class
- [00:26:58.110]for parents that you could sign up for and attend
- [00:27:00.750]if you want to be preventative and learn more.
- [00:27:04.020]And then finally,
- [00:27:04.853]I wanna lift up the entire organization of,
- [00:27:07.050]well actually, there's two, shoot.
- [00:27:08.820]One is Nebraska Children Families Foundation.
- [00:27:11.160]They are doing amazing, amazing work,
- [00:27:12.990]and you need to go to their website and search
- [00:27:15.330]for all the things that they're offering.
- [00:27:17.340]And then finally,
- [00:27:18.630]the Nebraska Resource Project for Vulnerable Young Children.
- [00:27:21.930]That's a mouthful, I understand that.
- [00:27:23.640]But we'll get it linked in the notes.
- [00:27:25.260]And that is your go-to
- [00:27:26.730]if you were looking for like a licensed therapist
- [00:27:29.040]who is specifically trained in the things
- [00:27:31.650]that Emily shared at my bio that I'm trained in,
- [00:27:33.840]these are clinical modalities,
- [00:27:35.790]specifically approved for young children birth through five.
- [00:27:39.240]And so if you are going to seek therapist guidance
- [00:27:42.570]or help for your young person,
- [00:27:44.700]I definitely want you to go to Nebraska Babies,
- [00:27:47.580]and find somebody who is specifically trained
- [00:27:50.160]in these specific models, because it's a unique population,
- [00:27:54.150]just because somebody's a therapist,
- [00:27:55.950]and they could be an amazing, amazing, amazing therapist,
- [00:27:58.230]and do beautiful things for children 8 to 12,
- [00:28:00.480]it does not mean that their skillset translates
- [00:28:02.580]to birth to 8.
- [00:28:03.570]And that's no disrespect for the providers
- [00:28:05.910]who are treating children 8 and up or 12 and up,
- [00:28:08.891]or teenage and up, but it means early childhood
- [00:28:10.590]is its own unique specialization.
- [00:28:13.277]And so, please make sure that you're finding somebody
- [00:28:14.670]from that Nebraska Babies website to these are providers
- [00:28:17.580]who really care about birth to 8.
- [00:28:18.900]Yeah, absolutely.
- [00:28:20.070]Yeah! Let's have a little bit of fun here.
- [00:28:22.020]Let's play a game, Carrie, you down for that?
- [00:28:24.420]Absolutely.
- [00:28:25.253]Okay, let's do behavior lightning round.
- [00:28:28.140]So, we're gonna call it get Involved or Let it Go.
- [00:28:31.950]So, I'm gonna read you a scenario about a child or children,
- [00:28:36.570]and I want you to tell us if we should get involved
- [00:28:39.390]in this situation, or if we can let it go.
- [00:28:42.360]Are you ready?
- [00:28:43.193]I'm ready.
- [00:28:44.026]Okay.
- [00:28:45.323]All right, so- I'm gonna be
- [00:28:46.156]terrible at this game.
- [00:28:46.989](both laughing)
- [00:28:47.850]We'll see how it goes.
- [00:28:48.960]Alright, so we have a group of children,
- [00:28:51.750]and they're playing cops and robbers together.
- [00:28:54.240]The children playing the cops are pretending
- [00:28:57.210]to shoot the robbers.
- [00:28:59.850]Bad at this game? (laughing)
- [00:29:02.712]And I gave you the most difficult one, probably at this.
- [00:29:03.545]Oh my gosh, okay, okay. (clears throat)
- [00:29:06.000]I will say that it is perfectly developmentally appropriate,
- [00:29:09.420]and I might get a lot of like questions from this response,
- [00:29:13.440]but it's actually very appropriately developmentally,
- [00:29:15.720]like it's developmentally appropriate.
- [00:29:17.947]Superhero, cops and robbers, shoot the gun, play.
- [00:29:21.210]It is normal.
- [00:29:23.550]It is so normal for little people to do that.
- [00:29:26.250]They play Ninja Turtles, they play Batman and Spider-Man,
- [00:29:29.580]they play Rescue the Princess,
- [00:29:31.860]and it involves swords and guns, and frying pans,
- [00:29:35.400]and that's okay.
- [00:29:36.846](Emily laughing)
- [00:29:37.679]Let it go.
- [00:29:38.512]Just let it go- Let it go.
- [00:29:39.345]Thanks for responding
- [00:29:40.178]on that one, (Carrie laughing)
- [00:29:41.011]that was a tough one.
- [00:29:42.630]Got our next one.
- [00:29:44.250]We have a child who does not finish their meal
- [00:29:47.760]because they don't like it.
- [00:29:49.740]Uh-um.
- [00:29:51.424](Emily laughing)
- [00:29:52.710]Okay, yeah, no, you're actually picking really good ones.
- [00:29:55.320]Like, I really appreciate this.
- [00:29:56.970]Oh, good!
- [00:29:57.810]You said not finishing their meal
- [00:29:59.520]because they don't like it.
- [00:30:00.870]Yeah, they don't like the way it tastes.
- [00:30:02.880]I love that they tasted it, thank you.
- [00:30:05.040]Thank you Emily, for tasting it.
- [00:30:07.276](Emily chuckling)
- [00:30:08.109]I would absolutely not force a child to finish it
- [00:30:09.900]if they did not like the way it tastes.
- [00:30:11.610]There's such complication when we talk about
- [00:30:14.280]sensory stuff and oral stuff, and taste acquisition.
- [00:30:19.830]It is a very complex thing,
- [00:30:21.660]and it unfolds over time a lot of time.
- [00:30:25.440]And so if your little person took a bite of something
- [00:30:28.380]and they don't like the bite, and they spit it out,
- [00:30:31.050]you know what?
- [00:30:31.883]Emily, thank you so much for trying it, and let it go.
- [00:30:35.010]Support the positive behavior that they tried it,
- [00:30:38.070]but then just let it go,
- [00:30:39.120]because- 100%.
- [00:30:40.607]I think of that as an adult,
- [00:30:41.440]like if I ordered something in a restaurant
- [00:30:44.280]and I didn't like it, I would not want someone
- [00:30:46.620]to force me to eat it.
- [00:30:48.240]Like naturally, I'm not gonna make a big deal about it
- [00:30:50.820]that I don't like it, but I don't wanna be forced
- [00:30:53.550]to eat something (chuckling) either that I don't like.
- [00:30:55.920]Right.
- [00:30:56.753]I have four kids.
- [00:30:58.500]My book ends, no, no, no, every other kid.
- [00:31:01.560]Two of my kids were growing up,
- [00:31:03.270]they were incredibly selective eaters.
- [00:31:05.430]They had limited palates.
- [00:31:07.590]And so, they only liked
- [00:31:09.660]a number of small number of foods.
- [00:31:11.250]And two of my kids would literally eat anything
- [00:31:13.050]you put in front of 'em.
- [00:31:14.070]Oh!
- [00:31:15.278]Well, all of my kids are 18 and up now, right?
- [00:31:17.010]So, my selective eaters are now 20 and 25.
- [00:31:22.394]They're not selective, they're not that selective anymore.
- [00:31:24.780]Like, you know what I mean?
- [00:31:25.800]Yeah- Like, these things
- [00:31:26.633]unfold over time.
- [00:31:27.810]So, they were super, like my 20-year-old, she grew up on,
- [00:31:30.960]things like chicken nuggets, mac and cheese,
- [00:31:32.490]all the things that we know are selective.
- [00:31:34.560]And now, my 25-year-old makes salads and grills,
- [00:31:38.190]chicken, and you know what I mean?
- [00:31:40.260]So, eats Chinese food- Right.
- [00:31:41.910]All the things.
- [00:31:42.743]And so, it's like, it just, yeah.
- [00:31:44.790]Yeah, it unfolds
- [00:31:45.930]over a long period of time- It's not something that we.
- [00:31:47.103]Need to stress over
- [00:31:48.480]when they're little- No, no.
- [00:31:50.300]No, no.
- [00:31:51.133]Certainly not, yeah.
- [00:31:52.440]Great answer, all right, next, next one.
- [00:31:54.750]Okay, we have a child who smears paint on the wall,
- [00:31:58.620]and you saw this happen.
- [00:32:00.420]When you ask if they did it,
- [00:32:02.010]they lie and said they didn't. (chuckling)
- [00:32:03.840]So, I have a whole little like soapbox on dishonesty.
- [00:32:07.980]Okay, ooh.
- [00:32:08.910]I kinda wanna hear it.
- [00:32:10.454](voices drown)
- [00:32:11.287](Carrie chuckling)
- [00:32:12.120]Sure.
- [00:32:12.953]This is not turning into lightning round,
- [00:32:13.786]but it's fine. (chuckling)
- [00:32:14.619]No, I was gonna say, I know, I'm so sorry.
- [00:32:16.260]First of all,
- [00:32:17.093]never ask a question to which you already know the answer.
- [00:32:20.640]Like, shame on you.
- [00:32:21.690]And that's, I'm not trying to like shame parents,
- [00:32:23.730]so I shouldn't have said it like that, but I'm like,
- [00:32:25.200]you watch the kid put the paint on the wall.
- [00:32:27.840]Do not say,
- [00:32:29.047]"Did you do that?" (Emily chuckling)
- [00:32:30.660]Why would, what? No!
- [00:32:33.120]So, never ask a question that
- [00:32:34.500]you already know the answer for!
- [00:32:35.490]You're just setting them up, number one.
- [00:32:37.740]Number two, kids are going to lie.
- [00:32:40.320]Like I told you at the very beginning,
- [00:32:42.150]I was such an insanely dishonest child.
- [00:32:44.250]Why do we lie?
- [00:32:45.083]We do it, shh, research.
- [00:32:47.100]There's this phenomenal research around this arena.
- [00:32:49.950]And honestly, the more you punish a child for lying,
- [00:32:52.710]and the more you like force a child to be honest,
- [00:32:56.820]and I'm not doing this justice
- [00:32:58.260]in this very short amount of time,
- [00:33:00.030]you actually are training the child to dig their heels
- [00:33:02.400]in more, and to try and look for ways
- [00:33:04.410]to be more dishonest.
- [00:33:05.880]And so research- Yeah,
- [00:33:06.713]I know research that you're speaking of,
- [00:33:08.400]Carrie, it's really interesting.
- [00:33:10.080]It is fascinating,
- [00:33:11.070]right- Yeah, it's fascinating.
- [00:33:12.150]Yeah!
- [00:33:13.269]Dig into it a little bit.
- [00:33:14.102]It's like, you know what, let it go!
- [00:33:14.935]So like, my 20-year-old
- [00:33:17.580]was also an incredibly dishonest child.
- [00:33:20.342]And I could empathize with her
- [00:33:21.480]because I was like, girlfriend,
- [00:33:22.320]I get it. (Emily chuckling)
- [00:33:23.562]Like, I was too.
- [00:33:24.395]And so like, I caught her lying all the time!
- [00:33:25.650]And so if I see a little person putting paint on the wall,
- [00:33:29.670]and I know they did it, depends on the age,
- [00:33:32.790]I'm very hand over hand because we have to learn
- [00:33:35.820]social skills with support and guidance, and all the things.
- [00:33:39.300]And so I don't yell from across the room, knock it off,
- [00:33:42.840]I walk up,
- [00:33:44.430]I'm actually physically there to be present and helpful.
- [00:33:46.980]And then I say something
- [00:33:47.840]to the effect of, "Oh wow, absolutely,
- [00:33:50.460]we do not paint on the wall."
- [00:33:52.359](Emily chuckling) And I take little hands,
- [00:33:53.550]and I walk the little body into the bathroom,
- [00:33:55.500]and I wash their hands.
- [00:33:57.270]And then I say, "Painting is so fun,
- [00:33:59.220]we love painting, we know that we love it on the paper,
- [00:34:01.650]but we need to get this off the wall."
- [00:34:03.948]And then, I help the little person clean it off the wall.
- [00:34:05.040]So that's not an ignore it at all.
- [00:34:07.020]Ignore the lying,
- [00:34:08.490]but in fact, A, ignore the lying, or B,
- [00:34:12.420]don't even ask the question
- [00:34:13.500]that you knew the answer to. (chuckling)
- [00:34:15.030]Love it, love it. (Carrie laughing)
- [00:34:17.310]'Cause you're just setting them up to lie!
- [00:34:19.260]With that!
- [00:34:20.093]And then,
- [00:34:21.417]it's a whole 'nother issue. (Emily's voice drowns)
- [00:34:22.250]Then we're dealing with two things.
- [00:34:23.083]Paint on the walls
- [00:34:23.916]and dishonesty- And the lie.
- [00:34:24.957]And yeah, not worth it.
- [00:34:26.580]I do have a question for you.
- [00:34:28.050]I wanted to expand more.
- [00:34:29.370]Why wouldn't you yell at them to just knock it off?
- [00:34:32.340](Carrie sighs)
- [00:34:33.173]Oh. (sighs)
- [00:34:34.006]'Cause is that because that's modeling,
- [00:34:35.490]like yelling at someone when you're angry?
- [00:34:38.640]Depends on the age,
- [00:34:39.660]but I'm envisioning a three-year-old,
- [00:34:41.430]and I'm not saying that depending on
- [00:34:45.240]the capacity of that child.
- [00:34:47.010]Like if I am cooking noodles in the kitchen,
- [00:34:49.170]and I look over and I see Carissa painting the walls,
- [00:34:52.260]I might be like, "Yo," (mumbling)
- [00:34:55.093](Emily chuckling)
- [00:34:55.926]like I can see me
- [00:34:56.759]reacting impulsively in kind of a, and she would startle,
- [00:35:00.510]I can see her little,
- [00:35:01.710]and she would look at me with these big dough eyes,
- [00:35:03.570]and I might be like, "Girlfriend, not on the wall!"
- [00:35:06.687](Emily laughing)
- [00:35:07.520]Like, I can see that unfold,
- [00:35:09.390]but I also know the capacity of that three-year-old
- [00:35:12.390]that I'm interacting with,
- [00:35:13.380]and his or her capacity to be able to be compliant
- [00:35:16.410]with my verbal direction.
- [00:35:17.910]Oh- From a distance.
- [00:35:20.324]Whereas, I also have worked in settings where I know that
- [00:35:22.440]little person doesn't have that kind of regulation capacity,
- [00:35:26.130]and that person maybe has more of a startled response,
- [00:35:29.010]and maybe a reaction where they become more defensive?
- [00:35:35.130]Because behaviors happen
- [00:35:36.180]in the context of a a relationship, and so I'm like, okay,
- [00:35:38.520]let's put me in a preschool setting, and let's say that
- [00:35:41.310]there's not as much of a relationship,
- [00:35:42.900]and this little person doesn't have
- [00:35:44.250]that secure attachment that they grew up with at home.
- [00:35:46.710]And I go, "Yo, yo, yo, yo, Michael!
- [00:35:49.140]What you doin' bud?" (Emily chuckling)
- [00:35:50.820]He might have a very different reaction than Crissa,
- [00:35:54.240]and I have to know Michael.
- [00:35:56.460]And so, Michael might run or he might laugh at me
- [00:36:00.210]and start painting on the wall more.
- [00:36:02.130]And I've just turned this into a very different scenario.
- [00:36:04.860]But that's because again,
- [00:36:06.874]back to the relationship
- [00:36:07.707]and why it's not a canned answer.
- [00:36:10.350]Yeah.
- [00:36:11.690]I dunno if that made sense.
- [00:36:12.523]Yes, yes.
- [00:36:13.356]So, with three-year-olds,
- [00:36:14.670]just their capacity for being able to follow directions,
- [00:36:17.400]verbal directions is not quite there,
- [00:36:19.980]so they kind of need that like,
- [00:36:21.420]physically being moved and being guided,
- [00:36:24.210]and your presence right there.
- [00:36:26.040]And then, the second part was with the startle response,
- [00:36:29.340]that might create more behaviors,
- [00:36:32.250]or it might escalate the situation, so.
- [00:36:35.487]100%- If we can,
- [00:36:36.320]if we can, try to calmly walk over and redirect
- [00:36:40.740]that child- Very much so, yep, yes.
- [00:36:42.990]Well-summarized.
- [00:36:44.610]Oh, thanks. (chuckling)
- [00:36:46.050]Well, I think that's all that we have time for.
- [00:36:47.760]We could talk about this for though.
- [00:36:50.830]I mean, it's like you said, "There's so much to it."
- [00:36:53.220]But please be sure to check out the resources
- [00:36:55.560]that we've mentioned during the podcast.
- [00:36:57.390]And feel free to send your questions
- [00:36:59.460]to our team's email, which is earlychildhood@unl.edu.
- [00:37:04.470]Thank you so much, Carrie,
- [00:37:05.580]for joining us on the podcast today,
- [00:37:07.080]I appreciated all your insights
- [00:37:08.580]and your wisdom with behaviors.
- [00:37:10.260]Thanks for havin' me!
- [00:37:11.400]I'm with you, I could talk
- [00:37:12.390]about this stuff all day, so. (chuckling)
- [00:37:14.160]This was a blast- Thank you!
- [00:37:15.390]We might have to have you back to talk again.
- [00:37:17.793](both laughing)
- [00:37:19.624]Thanks for the podcast, Emily,
- [00:37:20.457]thanks for all your efforts and what you're doing.
- [00:37:23.341]And thanks for having me on, I really appreciated it.
- [00:37:24.840]Yes, you bet, we love having you.
- [00:37:26.588](soft electronic music)
- [00:37:27.421]Next up is some advice
- [00:37:29.160]from a Nebraska youngster on how to be calm.
- [00:37:32.880]If you had to tell someone what calm meant,
- [00:37:35.963](whooshing music)
- [00:37:36.796]how would you describe it?
- [00:37:37.629]I feel like my body, (atmosphere humming)
- [00:37:40.770]it's not like (kid chattering distantly)
- [00:37:42.720]all like excited, and like,
- [00:37:46.410]feeling like it's gonna like blow up,
- [00:37:49.230]it feels like it's not gonna blow up,
- [00:37:51.630]it feels like a volcano, but it doesn't have any lava in it.
- [00:37:56.653](kids hollering)
- [00:37:57.486]When you feel calm, (people chattering distantly)
- [00:37:59.269]it feels like a volcano without any lava.
- [00:38:02.130]How do you get your lava to settle?
- [00:38:04.172]So, let's pretend like I think I'm gonna like burst.
- [00:38:07.236]And I'm ready, or Miss Emily,
- [00:38:08.069]what would you tell Miss Emily to help calm your body?
- [00:38:11.100]What's a strategy you use?
- [00:38:13.746]I put my hands on my belly and I breathe five times.
- [00:38:18.128](pleasant music)
- [00:38:18.961]And there you have it folks, just take some deep breaths,
- [00:38:21.120]everything's gonna be okay.
- [00:38:23.760]This has been
- [00:38:24.593]an episode of "The Good Life and Early Life,"
- [00:38:27.283]a Nebraska Extension Early Childhood production,
- [00:38:29.880]with your host, Emily Manning.
- [00:38:31.470]For more information on early childhood,
- [00:38:33.510]check out our website at child.unl.edu.
- [00:38:36.660]If you like the show,
- [00:38:37.500]subscribe and tell your friends to listen!
- [00:38:39.540]The show production team is Emily Manning,
- [00:38:41.790]Dr. Holly Hatton, Ingrid Lyndal,
- [00:38:44.070]Aaron Campbell, Linda Reddish,
- [00:38:45.990]Kim Wellsand, and Katie Kraus.
- [00:38:47.970]See you next time, and thanks for listening.
- [00:38:50.847]Buh-bye.
- [00:38:51.739](electronic music)
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