Hixson-Lied Visiting Artist: Mark Dion
Conceptual artist Mark Dion will present the next Hixson-Lied Visiting Artist Lecture. Dion’s work examines the ways in which dominant ideologies and public institutions shape our understanding of history, knowledge and the natural world. Appropriating archaeological, field ecology and other scientific methods of collecting, ordering and exhibiting objects, Dion creates works that question the distinctions between ‘objective’ (‘rational’) scientific methods and ‘subjective’ (‘irrational’) influences.
Dion also frequently collaborates with museums of natural history, aquariums, zoos and other institutions mandated to produce public knowledge on the topic of nature. He is the co-director of Mildred’s Land an innovative visual art education and residency program in Beach Lake, Pennsylvania. For more than two decades, Dion has worked in the public realm in a wide range of scales, from architecture projects to print interventions in newspapers.
This lecture is free and open to the public.
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[00:00:03.320]Mark Dion: For people so when I see a crowd like this.
[00:00:07.640]Mark Dion: And it has been a great trip, I want to thank you for inviting me, I want to thank the amazing printmakers i've been working with the grads right so.
[00:00:19.080]Mark Dion: Thank you, Sarah.
[00:00:23.120]Mark Dion: Thank you very much for making something for me.
[00:00:27.320]Mark Dion: I was going to talk about this particular i'm talking about a lot of work is going to be really fast paced so he.
[00:00:34.520]Mark Dion: And I wasn't in talking about this, but we talked about it in seminar today and so some people ask me questions but it's not technical enough should show it to be.
[00:00:42.800]Mark Dion: About it's just be part of that journey, so this is a work that was done in Canada in Toronto, where the contemporary in Toronto and.
[00:00:51.920]Mark Dion: as I do that, very often, all my work starts through the site visit and the site really tells me what to do you know the site really drives my process, so when I was there wasn't any breaker.
[00:01:05.360]Mark Dion: breaker as far as good and, as I was there, the sounds of chain saws just going constantly because.
[00:01:11.760]Mark Dion: The city trees are being chopped down and and you know some of the very substantial the old people were incredibly sad and exactly don't want good.
[00:01:21.520]Mark Dion: Things are being chopped down and they're being chopped down because of an accidentally introduced invasive insects so it's like that came to America through global trade so came in.
[00:01:33.080]Mark Dion: Inside of wooden shipping pallets it's called the Emerald ash borer you might have heard of it it's one of many invasive species that have been accidentally introduced here through you know through international trade right, so I thought let's try to.
[00:01:49.680]Mark Dion: let's try to make that a little more apparent for people, so they can have a close encounter with the Emerald ash borer and figure out what's going on, so we found this enormous trades at hundred and 60 year old ash tree.
[00:02:00.200]Mark Dion: And we took it it died, about two years before and we took it or it's it's functionally death this little bit of zombie the trees doesn't know it's dead, but it's there.
[00:02:12.320]Mark Dion: And we brought back into the new space of this museum, which is a very.
[00:02:17.480]Mark Dion: could have been a parking lot before you know, but it was actually a factory building, so we reassembled the tree their third Frankenstein like.
[00:02:25.880]Mark Dion: And we established a field laboratory and an entomology field laboratory.
[00:02:32.080]Mark Dion: And also processing laboratory so you know you can imagine you're going to an art museum and you step off the elevator, and this is what you walk into so it's a bit of a shock right it doesn't feel like.
[00:02:43.120]Mark Dion: A conventional art exhibition there's also this lab where you can see us processing what we're finding and you can look at now i'm very much often make the scientists themselves a specimen for the collectors themselves a specimen So you can see us in our living diary Rama.
[00:03:03.200]Mark Dion: And so I didn't know 100% for sure, but there were Emerald ash borer in here, so this is a this was a big yeah a big bet and.
[00:03:11.480]Mark Dion: It would have been rather embarrassing weekend this tree that, with all that work and energy and it wasn't so we started immediately begin so Emerald ash borer they eat.
[00:03:21.800]Mark Dion: They eat the layer in between the bark and the hard part would have the tree right and so that layer which is delicious to them.
[00:03:29.720]Mark Dion: They they sever the connection so that layers Blair that transports water and and nutrients up and down the tree So if you if you break that where the nutrients just can move up and down the tree the tree dies.
[00:03:42.080]Mark Dion: So they have a good, you know kind of complicated life cycle is, it is a seed and then there's a grub which is, which is like a large flat heaven worm that is munching away and leaving these beautiful traces and then there's also a Cuba.
[00:04:02.120]Mark Dion: And these are, these are the traces of the Emerald ash borer, so we are almost like doing a CSR investigation, the crime and guess who murdered this hash tree, you know and we're taking the tree apart and.
[00:04:16.880]Mark Dion: And this is something that people could come in and see So you see that process, you understand what's going on with these trees with these trees that are all around us why they're dying and.
[00:04:28.920]Mark Dion: The insect that's killing them is actually an adorable little thing but also it talks.
[00:04:33.640]Mark Dion: We also talking about the tree, not just as it's not just one life tree is many lives right there are many things.
[00:04:41.000]Mark Dion: That are living in on and around this tree the Emerald ash borer it's just one of them right so we're also finding these other organisms and because i'm working with the natural history museum and the entomologist.
[00:04:52.440]Mark Dion: You know, we we are able to take these incredible images of these organisms that we're finding.
[00:05:00.480]Mark Dion: And you know there's just lots and lots of things in and around the tree.
[00:05:05.240]Mark Dion: So you know this is anxiety, the beginning, are there going to be internal dashboard start healing whether signs and find the find some drums.
[00:05:13.720]Mark Dion: And then, a week later, we find in Cuba and then all of a sudden, the museum just explodes with Emerald ash books right, this is obviously museum doesn't have a collection, I, like the museum registrar's nightmare.
[00:05:27.360]Mark Dion: And so, you see, like the Emerald ash borer is this very cares it's tiny but it's very charismatic it's a metallic green and kind of amazing, and so in the exhibition i'm showing the progress will be fine and i'm also I also produce these sort of charts that.
[00:05:44.240]Mark Dion: These are actually screen prints and you know, preventing often even COMP a project like this current making also has a very strong role so.
[00:05:51.760]Mark Dion: These are various organisms, all of which have really interesting natural history, so I have.
[00:05:57.200]Mark Dion: Cultural histories as well right the natural histories are entirely intertwined with us moving products around the globe and and creating you know.
[00:06:07.240]Mark Dion: Crisis evolutions and you mentioned, which were being oriented, but I have no natural predators into places and they you know, some of them like the gypsy lot they've been here for you know for years and years.
[00:06:20.480]Mark Dion: Some of them have really interesting stories like this is, you know, the Dutch elm disease that killed all of our films is is an extra fungus that's carry into the tree by the elm bark beetle so it's a it's a kind of one two punch.
[00:06:37.160]Mark Dion: This is maybe one of the organisms, and this is a really big spectacular looking beat up and.
[00:06:44.960]Mark Dion: This is maybe one of the only times that we might have this actually under control, we might have stopped that Asian longhorn beetle partially because it's so big and so flagrant and so.
[00:06:56.480]Mark Dion: You know, and another thing is that these things are changing our forests, right in the same way that.
[00:07:02.680]Mark Dion: When chance not blind came here, you know chances were big part of North American for us right, and so you remove something like chess chess and often ignored, some energy.
[00:07:12.440]Mark Dion: for things like bears and and and fungibility dear loosen things like that you just remove them out those animals have to hustle and try to find a new way of making a living and that's very much going to happen with.
[00:07:25.760]Mark Dion: You know the first one, I showed effects had lungs, we have ashes chestnuts gone, you have elms done so we really have to take a little more seriously precautions about what happens when we don't know what would have left enforced and so there's actually another.
[00:07:47.720]Mark Dion: organism that's that's just arrived recently, and that is kind of interesting like making its way all over, but it is actually eating.
[00:07:57.000]Mark Dion: Another invasive invasive plants, so you know it's very funny that we have this weird story in that that isn't a typical project in some way, but I wanted to show because we did have a discussion and.
[00:08:10.520]Mark Dion: So.
[00:08:12.080]Mark Dion: When I do talk it's really like a travel blog i'm like you're hopefully your favorite uncle comes over he wants to show his vacation pictures so.
[00:08:21.520]Mark Dion: i'm going to take you to Venice, you know this incredible city of art history and and the history of commerce and.
[00:08:30.520]Mark Dion: Technology last remnants and you know, I was invited to do a project of foot beds, you know and i'm interested in in the process of you know, of how an artwork gets made in the you know the heyday of Venice, you know that the Renaissance, so you know we always think about.
[00:08:50.480]Mark Dion: You know that that artists research or research based artist, like myself, but that's a new thing and there's nothing to be further from the truth, artists, of the Renaissance, have a special space, even within their studio studio look where that's where they.
[00:09:05.040]Mark Dion: do their research and with the reparation drawings, maybe, where they need their patrons they were they keep their handful of books, because.
[00:09:13.160]Mark Dion: Nobody has a lot of books, back then, and so this is my so I wanted to create an exhibition that follows the big even artwork.
[00:09:21.120]Mark Dion: From the studio all the way through production to the final exhibition and i'm also showing what the what my artist is interested in is low budget.
[00:09:30.920]Mark Dion: To the alum is the Cabinet wonder so that's what's being research so that history of you know what we might think about as.
[00:09:39.400]Mark Dion: Pretty museum collections these pre enlightenment collections which.
[00:09:43.640]Mark Dion: You know they're making it more interesting in in ways that they're not like our museums, that in ways that they are they're amazingly numerous throughout Europe.
[00:09:52.760]Mark Dion: In the 16th and 17th century there are hundreds of them and they all reflect not.
[00:09:59.560]Mark Dion: A kind of unifying scientific order, but you have an excitement but individual.
[00:10:04.440]Mark Dion: It doesn't have a quarter right so some of them, we could almost call proto scientific some we could call it more magical and mystical some are more tied to the history of alchemy and dramatic tradition.
[00:10:15.920]Mark Dion: Some really are kind of hinting at science they're very much, of course, a symptom of of the of the most horrific colonial endeavor right the Europeans discovering the rest of the world subjugating people.
[00:10:30.720]Mark Dion: Taking lead sources all of that, and this is, this is very much part of that story, but it's an interesting part of that story, because this is the intellectual part of these people are trying to imagine what this stuff is right.
[00:10:44.240]Mark Dion: There their theology gives them an idea of part of the world is is is structure but it doesn't prepare them for the reality, but they discovered the new worlds and in Asia and and, of course.
[00:10:59.880]Mark Dion: they're looking at these things to understand the the handiwork of God himself, but they're also looking for new products of the.
[00:11:08.520]Mark Dion: coca the new tobacco right the new the new pump the new attain right So these are really interesting laboratories of ideas and so and they're very discursive spaces right So you see, like people hanging out we're talking about like today's museum where it's like.
[00:11:28.400]Mark Dion: In a church where the weinberg no these are like place where people are speaking about things there's also books in.
[00:11:36.560]Mark Dion: And, and this is where you know if you're a collector you invite people over, and you are you're possibly a merchant and you're testing them like.
[00:11:45.920]Mark Dion: What about their world outlaws What about their understanding of the classical tradition, what about their theology like.
[00:11:52.320]Mark Dion: you're using these objects to kind of figure out who you're talking to they're also very dynamic they're not like static museum things are being exchanged and traded so it's a really interesting place so.
[00:12:04.160]Mark Dion: i'm interested in this thing where imagine 400 years ago there's some Dutch sailor is probably part of a horrific colonial endeavor but he's in someplace that we might today call the Philippines.
[00:12:15.680]Mark Dion: And he finds the cce now right, so he kills this now boils and other bits Shell takes a Shell polishes of puts that into his hammock.
[00:12:27.200]Mark Dion: Two or three years later he gets back to Amsterdam he takes the Shell, to the end of the dock and he sells into curiosity deal.
[00:12:35.800]Mark Dion: Then sells it to a collection then puts it in his cosmological cabinet where it's drawn by an artist engraved by an engraver and bounded to a book.
[00:12:49.040]Mark Dion: And that's the end of the story for four years, so now, I want to pick up that story it's like a game of telephone.
[00:12:55.440]Mark Dion: thing it's a living part of ecology and and every step is getting further from that until the point where it's like a wacky picture of something right.
[00:13:04.280]Mark Dion: So i'm going to take that back into the realm of the material because i'm still here, so I created after the studio the workshop and in the workshop.
[00:13:13.520]Mark Dion: If you come on a good day, you will see my lovely team, and I, and we are working very hard to take all the things that we see in those engravings and to materialize them again in three dimensions.
[00:13:26.640]Mark Dion: So I have a killer staff, this is my friend christy gas was a student of mine, many years ago, and she joined us and she's fantastic sculptor.
[00:13:38.480]Mark Dion: Pandora guests who used to work with Jim henson company is a puppeteer and break stop there, and you know every Captain wonder needs a crocodile and so, if you're going to make a crocodile endorse your person Clara hops.
[00:13:52.480]Mark Dion: into Sherwood.
[00:13:55.160]Mark Dion: And then from the basic that room we go to the next room where we were This is where all of the grinding and the standing and all of the horrible things happen so so the visitors don't spend much time.
[00:14:06.200]Mark Dion: Now this isn't working toward the exhibition, this is the exhibition right so when visitors come they see they experienced these different stages.
[00:14:16.560]Mark Dion: And then, a person is finishing room where we give the objects that are last hope it's like when the equivalent of the varnishing room in the in the Renaissance, where you've been finished the painting.
[00:14:27.520]Mark Dion: Here is my bond a jelly like chilling Venus like Sarah mercer helper who's putting on the final code and it's finally enter into the habit of wonder stuff and all of the objects we've made I covered with phosphorescent.
[00:14:41.160]Mark Dion: So I never really recovered from my childhood experience, though dispensers gift shop and seeing all the things that dark and so I love the idea of taking some something really hokey like glow in the dark, too, but also, I want these objects.
[00:14:56.440]Mark Dion: I want this to be kind of quite melancholic process right, and these are these are kind of ghosts of things that were once really in the world.
[00:15:05.360]Mark Dion: And so, when visitors come through you know come and see the entire cabinet finished well depends on what you've come, but if you're there, the first you know five weeks of the show.
[00:15:15.080]Mark Dion: You see that there are holes there because we're still working on things are still working on.
[00:15:19.400]Mark Dion: objects that are in these categories and what's interesting about the cameras the way they are, they blend categories so it's not just the natural the artificial naturally artificial.
[00:15:30.080]Mark Dion: Often together right and there's and you know there's an interest in in things that are exceptional right because the goal is to.
[00:15:42.120]Mark Dion: understand the methodology of God to looking at nature and in other cultures and and sometimes those secrets might be revealed in the exceptions in the monster X right the protests, the misfires right.
[00:15:57.200]Mark Dion: So, so this big emphasis on those things, and you know these objects all have a relationship to you know that history so here, you see, in the middle, you see this break off.
[00:16:07.880]Mark Dion: Which is just one of our extinct birds, you know, it was a bird that was especially interesting, this is the bird that was it was brought to extinction by collectors is going to new they're getting so few so they wanted to get the last one right.
[00:16:22.560]Mark Dion: Nice and you see there's a mixture of ethnographic objects terror technology.
[00:16:31.160]Mark Dion: And all of these again are coming from these engravings running so it's really big for me from it that's really interesting that that relationship that we've been talking about the friendship between science and.
[00:16:42.400]Mark Dion: Science and and brick making engraving an image making right so that's for me something really exciting about this work, so these are all if you know your print history, you can see, within here, you know.
[00:16:57.840]Mark Dion: Marxist Marin and Conrad gesner and even Dewar in some of these images right.
[00:17:09.680]Mark Dion: I often work trying to make something like a promo with your camera, in a sense, um and then it was about intentionally in some way, make a folder, so this is this is in Tulsa Oklahoma, this is a place called the gathering place or gathering place, and this is a boat House so.
[00:17:27.760]Mark Dion: You know there's this amazing it park that was built by George Kaiser in in Tulsa Oklahoma and it has all these extraordinary features that has been.
[00:17:38.360]Mark Dion: identified acres of adventure playground for kids has a boat and has boathouse within a link where you can bring with us with us.
[00:17:47.240]Mark Dion: In this building the designers always had something called the cabinet of curiosity without really knowing what that would ever be so they invited me to tell to tell some and they said.
[00:17:58.240]Mark Dion: You know, and so I gave a lecture I do lecture just on the capital of curiosity and, at the end, it took me to dinner, and they said okay kid you've got the job and the job is it well somebody's going to fill this thing.
[00:18:11.440]Mark Dion: And so they basically give you the credit card and I get to make a capital you're asking so here it is so so we built a very undulating space, the room itself is a curiosity, there are 36 drawers in this room and very much in the way that.
[00:18:30.520]Mark Dion: These three enlightenment collectors are using allegories and and other ways of organizing their collection and they're organizing things around the seasons, the elements that works so i'm trying to do the same and so.
[00:18:48.720]Mark Dion: The first thing I bought was actually this worse gallatin so I thought you know this, this could either be a great job or really terrible job and we'll see what happens when.
[00:18:57.080]Mark Dion: I make the first like $12,000 purchase if they give you our time nobody blinked.
[00:19:02.480]Mark Dion: So I knew was going to be a great job, so I just started to spend my time traveling around the world, always bringing the extra suitcases and.
[00:19:10.800]Mark Dion: bubble wrap and take, and I am masks incredible collection of what I hope aren't really exciting and curious objects and really try to also mix high and low contemporary and historic.
[00:19:25.680]Mark Dion: Fine, art and vernacular art.
[00:19:30.160]Mark Dion: Local things and international days, of course, as I said, every every hundred leads a crocodile stuff I bought this crocodile and.
[00:19:39.440]Mark Dion: within a couple weeks, they were there were these myths about the propaganda that had been won by by Roy Rogers in a card game.
[00:19:46.880]Mark Dion: I don't know where this came from I didn't start this myth, but and there's a.
[00:19:51.080]Mark Dion: telephone is like a telephone from a very things steak house that was in Tulsa that everybody knows that so when you know what these objects, are they have a different kind of resonance in here, you see sort of allegories of water, air fire Earth.
[00:20:08.800]Mark Dion: And i'm trying to put together really curious things and also get a sense that, even though there's a receivable level of stuff there's also stuffing can't see so there's boxes that are full of marvelous things that you can't help right.
[00:20:23.520]Mark Dion: There are two secret rooms ones, which is filled with blood, the dark objects there's lots of strange things like this cupboard is just filled with him and busts.
[00:20:34.480]Mark Dion: This is with architectural follies medical models and plush animals, so when I when I made the original proposal, I drawing what it might look like and then there was.
[00:20:43.880]Mark Dion: The teddy bear trying because i've just had to fill up space and somebody like mark their trigger and they're so special about charity here and I thought i'm gonna fill this thing plush toys just for you.
[00:20:55.800]Mark Dion: So it, you know I really want this to have a kind of these kind of surprising juxtaposition it's right between high and low ancient monitor the local in the far flung.
[00:21:11.040]Mark Dion: As I feel this with fresh tracks.
[00:21:14.640]Mark Dion: And there's also a layer that is just books and the books are accessible so even come in and take the books, you can read the books, we have a vast.
[00:21:22.600]Mark Dion: reserve of books, so if you know if somebody steals but it's not the end of the world there are worse things to steal and and there's.
[00:21:31.200]Mark Dion: Because we made the undulating room there are spaces behind the walls which I can't.
[00:21:36.200]Mark Dion: And a little vacuum, so I created this the office of the Estonian collections and if you hear things window you see what seems to be like.
[00:21:45.360]Mark Dion: The tinkers room right and everything it's actually built in perspective, so it looks like it's bigger and it goes back further than it's so much, but the shelf is respected tables built in perspective.
[00:21:58.720]Mark Dion: Okay now on our on our tour.
[00:22:02.600]Mark Dion: we're going to go to the arlen mountains in Norway Norway is an extraordinary country like it's really I mean it's just it's amazing so many ways, but one of the ways this amazing is, as you probably know, it's become very wealthy because of its oil reserves and.
[00:22:18.960]Mark Dion: Those oil reserves are nationalized so instead of all the profits from petroleum he knows a lot of practice, instead of going into the pockets of shareholders or family.
[00:22:30.080]Mark Dion: But or five done it goes into the nation, and so they know it's not gonna last forever so they are building new airport.
[00:22:39.320]Mark Dion: in hospitals in opera house is in universities new roads new ports, so all of that money is going into building an infrastructure that will last right so it's incredibly interesting.
[00:22:52.680]Mark Dion: i'm presuming it doesn't all go underwater something because it's really but anyway so that's really interesting so.
[00:23:01.600]Mark Dion: One of the things that they just they built between Bergen and also they had a highway system that goes over these mountains and even with the greatest technology that that.
[00:23:12.440]Mark Dion: They can you can't keep this road open all year it's just too much damn snow minutes.
[00:23:18.440]Mark Dion: So with this with this money they built these tunnels so there's a tunnel that's 65 kilometers long.
[00:23:25.520]Mark Dion: It goes under series of mountains, including the Parliament, the early mountain you know, this is the hottest day in August never worn the top of the heart.
[00:23:34.840]Mark Dion: You know, obviously well about tree level so um So the idea was that what we do with overrides right they go through amazing landscape, I mean they passed, you know the past cliffs going to.
[00:23:50.240]Mark Dion: Beautiful fjords of the process miles and miles of time dre and glacial ponds and it's stunningly beautiful okay let's make this the tourists from so people come from all over the world and see how beautiful this funny things right, and so.
[00:24:08.040]Mark Dion: And so, then.
[00:24:11.960]Mark Dion: turns on, and so, then.
[00:24:14.840]Mark Dion: that's great but that's not enough let's hire young forward thinking radical architecture firms to build all the stuff scenic overlook.
[00:24:25.240]Mark Dion: Rest dumps yes stitches hotels, so you have to do that for 10 years it's amazing I mean the architecture is so forward thinking crazy.
[00:24:35.320]Mark Dion: And they say okay now let's put in the public and so they do big project for us which one with fish device, and they took me here and they said.
[00:24:44.360]Mark Dion: We want you to work here, I thought, what could be the worst idea messing up the landscape that this like this will work for right, I mean.
[00:24:51.920]Mark Dion: disaster, so I had to think Okay, how can I work in this landscape left strong science, so I did a lot of.
[00:24:59.640]Mark Dion: Deep dive into Norwegian culture to reach history know their region mythology you know chris's is tradition of.
[00:25:08.000]Mark Dion: Fighting burial grounds and violence and and in Norwegian mythology there's a lot of fun in many mythology says love commerce between our world in the underworld so let's let's make it interesting under works here right but it's my height not know region sites.
[00:25:24.320]Mark Dion: And so you go through here is entrance and you pass about 35 feet in total darkness and then you find yourself in a room and in that room you're confronted with a diagram of using natural history.
[00:25:38.960]Mark Dion: likely excellent diagrams that are here for a reason and that diagram it depicts the interior of the case.
[00:25:46.440]Mark Dion: And inside of that kayla has the live titles like might lose a little bit maybe more like.
[00:25:52.400]Mark Dion: kind of cave you might see on the first series of star trek, then you might see in the wilds but but that's intentional, you know.
[00:25:59.880]Mark Dion: And then there's a giant pile of garbage of material culture, starting with like stone flakes you know, starting with you know, Neil is in paleolithic objects.
[00:26:11.120]Mark Dion: And then going to the refinements of weapons, the you know the iron age, the Bronze age, the Viking culture, the beginnings of agriculture, the influence of the classical world all the way in the far north.
[00:26:27.440]Mark Dion: To the beginnings of really agriculture, the Industrial Revolution, he mentioned plastics, the information.
[00:26:37.480]Mark Dion: revolution right so everything up into our moment effect suddenly lose the slide carousel just below there so that's like the recent past, some art historians might appreciate that.
[00:26:48.600]Mark Dion: And then conspicuously On top of this case you have noticed, is a very large there right so when you go to place like the mountains, it just feels very like intact as an as an ecology right the small plants are there, the fun geez there the Insects are there.
[00:27:09.640]Mark Dion: And the small animals and birds are there, but the two things missing bears and wolves the two things that we feel like we cannot tolerate in are.
[00:27:20.560]Mark Dion: The two things that we feel like some of our direct competition, so I think about the bear has this kind of emblem of wilderness in the sense like we're bears are usually people aren't.
[00:27:31.400]Mark Dion: And so, our bear is just you know she's just kind of sleeping off this thing we call the intimacy of the sacred cow civilization is waiting for her moment to come back to the surface, to come out of the door.
[00:27:49.840]Mark Dion: Okay back to events.
[00:27:53.480]Mark Dion: way back in 1997 I was invited to be the guest of the Nordic pavilion of the Venice biennale because I am the Nordic idea was clearly town and.
[00:28:04.800]Mark Dion: You know the Venice is you know this city great history great romance and literature and architecture is also plays a very disgusting fun right and that is at the bottom of the nouns and.
[00:28:19.400]Mark Dion: You know everything moved by that was no roads events, you have to move by water water is art is the routes, so you can imagine if you get something like a big screen TV watch the superbowl, it has to come by March right.
[00:28:32.640]Mark Dion: And if you're washing machine breaks as leads by barge unless, of course, in the middle of the night.
[00:28:39.200]Mark Dion: You get too close to the edge of the canal and there's a gentle plot and you've solved yourself a big problem right.
[00:28:45.200]Mark Dion: So all of these things build up to the bottom of the counts and the city has a solution, they have a navy of barges that dredge the canals in this very kind of mechanical.
[00:28:57.440]Mark Dion: way right like they take up too much they put it into the Center of the barge they sell out Luca and they dumped it and they do this over and over and over so I wanted to know what's in that, and so I convinced the city to give me the contents of one of these markets.
[00:29:19.160]Mark Dion: we've put in front of beautiful not it without him.
[00:29:22.560]Mark Dion: If you've ever been to Venice in low tide, you know that this stuff is fragrant right it's enough to really rough it is you know it's it's.
[00:29:34.040]Mark Dion: it's has that rotten egg smell right, it is it's full of a weird ecology of of of.
[00:29:42.680]Mark Dion: You know anaerobic bacteria and will shrimp and worms and it's has a lot of chemicals and petroleum in it, but.
[00:29:53.680]Mark Dion: It is so archaeologically rich you could stick a pencil into it without hitting something right, so my job became.
[00:30:01.200]Mark Dion: To clean this sample over the course of the summer and to remove every human made think that I could find it.
[00:30:08.480]Mark Dion: And to do that I installed it in after after cleaning everything funny I sold it in those.
[00:30:14.840]Mark Dion: A trend their store house the store room into a kind of something in between the one your camera the Renaissance and the treasure trove of the of the Middle Ages, like religious you take your.
[00:30:26.120]Mark Dion: treasure and you hide them away the darkest dungeon and the highest power is the Renaissance, they kind of just never blinked right they know that you're trading treasures doing.
[00:30:35.560]Mark Dion: double duty if you show them the show how smart, you are, how much influence wealthy anyway, I don't have treasures I don't have emeralds broken the bonus I don't have.
[00:30:47.240]Mark Dion: pearls I have white broken white ceramic parts, I have a crocodile, but I still have good stuff right so i'm showing these things.
[00:30:56.080]Mark Dion: In a way, that doesn't recapitulate what archaeology museum to do there are, in the sense of archaeology museum.
[00:31:02.800]Mark Dion: They tell you the story of the evolution of techniques and technologies changes and design a one societies.
[00:31:11.080]Mark Dion: design and materials influences another society so it's not my job so i'm trying to put things together, and a bunch more associate way, in a sense, i'm trying to pretend to be the.
[00:31:22.280]Mark Dion: martian archaeologist who doesn't know what these things are what they're for an organized members superficially based on formal qualities right.
[00:31:30.160]Mark Dion: or other things, and in some sense i'm trying to suspend my expertise at the same time I can't help a mess with your ideas about what museums, are what the same should be for right.
[00:31:41.240]Mark Dion: So information in the sense, so in this case, you see a collection of the ceramics that we we found.
[00:31:48.200]Mark Dion: Any of the strengths of our advanced is not an old city by the accounting standards, you know, trusting Venice it's not really a Roman Venice so it's a pretty recent sitting for forget.
[00:31:59.840]Mark Dion: About we're still finding stuff in the Middle Ages and easy everything to scrupulously number, but if you try to find the reference for that who crazy because it's not there because i'm not.
[00:32:09.880]Mark Dion: i'm just going so far, I want to frustrate your expectations, I want this to drive you NUTS right, and then the third part, all of a lot of the archaeological projects, I did whoa.
[00:32:20.920]Mark Dion: So um brief architect.
[00:32:24.320]Mark Dion: To have three parts at the data itself, they have the processing of material or, then you know processing.
[00:32:31.560]Mark Dion: They have a final you know just select right, so in this case, you see, you can go into the background and you see stuff in the process of being clean that sort So you see.
[00:32:42.520]Mark Dion: objects that are still embedded in mud things that are began to be clean things are starting to take rudimentary categories baby categories that don't even exist in the display part So you see, like all the attention right.
[00:32:55.720]Mark Dion: And i'm really interested in process so for those of us who went to the Museum of natural history yesterday.
[00:33:01.120]Mark Dion: But this is very easy and natural history, the displays are amazing but that's nothing compared to back right.
[00:33:06.840]Mark Dion: And when you whenever you go pull the curtain and go behind the scenes and museum you realize this is where it's at right, but the exhibitions are.
[00:33:14.960]Mark Dion: Great so remedial knowledge, whatever What was really going on behind the scenes and so so i'm pretty I can't take it road by the scenes, all the time, so I create this theatrical moments.
[00:33:28.800]Mark Dion: So were you see process, you know we're all kind of spoiled because we're artists, we get to go to mark studios all the time right.
[00:33:35.600]Mark Dion: i've never seen a painting that was more interesting in the museum and wasn't the morning students right So how do we, how can I do that, how can I create that so so here, you see all of the things.
[00:33:45.760]Mark Dion: I found it kind of a long thing So you see them in different parts of working with as many no organization for just the beginning to organization, and this was you know by far the worst summer of my entire life.
[00:34:00.040]Mark Dion: I had to get tight shots I had to get you know, like like the tetanus shots like Dennis is hot the vm.
[00:34:11.080]Mark Dion: density, not this crowded and the piece was very popular so lots of indicate that couldn't get work done, he were interrogating me but it didn't get you know so attention so i've been I thought that's it i'm done no more archaeological projects for me.
[00:34:29.080]Mark Dion: So my next archaeological project London.
[00:34:33.600]Mark Dion: Again i'm really interested in the idea of using water as a kind of metaphor for the passage of time, like.
[00:34:40.320]Mark Dion: You know, one of the things that that irks me about archaeological museums and places is that they do kind of reinforce this idea that we are at the pinnacle.
[00:34:49.240]Mark Dion: Right now, that time is is a constant which we are at one moment people go far beyond that's in that idea of thinking about ourselves.
[00:34:58.240]Mark Dion: As the end of something is one of the reasons why we're culturally get ourselves in trouble right so anyway, but.
[00:35:05.640]Mark Dion: The London is a much older city that that London is there were many cities part because of a river Thames River Thames river is a tight river so twice a day.
[00:35:17.280]Mark Dion: This area that you see here is called for sure for sure is visible twice a day for about four hours and at different heights depending on.
[00:35:26.960]Mark Dion: So this was a time when suddenly there were two takes in London so there's always take advantage of the take rate and the taint monitor, so this is.
[00:35:36.720]Mark Dion: here before the team monitors opens Tate modern hands and incredibly energetic snap or curators their fabricators this publicity people there's only two people, but they don't give us the.
[00:35:48.400]Mark Dion: year before, so they wanted to do projects that they all fell through except my project, so I get all that energy all that love that this project, and so the for short is.
[00:36:01.960]Mark Dion: An impossibly archaeologically you couldn't go there and look without looking down and seeing something so it's just full of.
[00:36:11.160]Mark Dion: Material culture of human made stuff so I created a group of volunteers I don't know why, because the volunteer this every second Okay, but on.
[00:36:20.800]Mark Dion: And they were either over 65 we're under 70 so teenagers and pensioners and we we gotta do to get working mostly the surface mines one in front of tape monitor and one in front of taper.
[00:36:35.760]Mark Dion: And so, one week and each 34 hours a day about 18 to 24 you can get a lot of stuff to them, so this is we identified and have them my team are these people with the bright orange safety events.
[00:36:52.040]Mark Dion: That other group on the water it's actually a coven of witches who are doing a good day baptism because this is the summer solstice.
[00:37:01.520]Mark Dion: sunlight of the magic going on on the 10th I have incredible helicopters, you know these are two assistants will work with me.
[00:37:10.960]Mark Dion: And who i've worked with quite working on other projects, one of them is like the Clinton was a fantastic artists from his list of Pittsburgh now us from Cornwall.
[00:37:20.480]Mark Dion: So I worked like these artists have seen it and Alexis to him when I work with bad luck uncanny ability to find their funding needles and pins from the London bridge at tumbled into the 10th That was the Center of the wire nail evil hidden tricks so.
[00:37:42.760]Mark Dion: This would be my group on any day looks like a pirate.
[00:37:47.880]Mark Dion: And so that's it that's Stage one so two days on each side.
[00:37:54.360]Mark Dion: You could catch it as a member of the public are probably not so many people, so the next situation is much more flagrant.
[00:38:03.040]Mark Dion: And that is we build these indiana style indiana Jones style tense on the lawn of the tapes or colonizing the colonizer and.
[00:38:12.760]Mark Dion: Three tents, one for Millbank one for bank side and one where we do every day, a midday lecture about the history of the Thames.
[00:38:22.440]Mark Dion: And and we're kind of doing our research after the fact, so we have people have a practical relationship with the temps like harbourmaster the test least for us, we have.
[00:38:33.960]Mark Dion: Our historians want to talk about turner's interest in the 10s we have people going back to talk about the globe theatre attends then archaeologists we have social historians, we have a really interesting group of people and but every day.
[00:38:51.160]Mark Dion: Every day we are processing all the stuff we found and we found an enormous amount of stuff But just think about how much 20 people can collect.
[00:39:01.160]Mark Dion: You know, in four days and all of that is in a sense it all comes out every little thing every bit of broken glass of white ceramic every coin every.
[00:39:14.520]Mark Dion: And everything comes out and is cleaned and processed and inventory and you know we have this tape which was.
[00:39:24.960]Mark Dion: You know this is this like a really busy area, think about the steps of the artists or the metropolitan Center like a lot of people.
[00:39:31.720]Mark Dion: Are in here, so the tape keeps our casual viewers, but the general rule is that unless someone is an obvious lunatic we invite them to come behind.
[00:39:40.880]Mark Dion: People tended to treat us a little bit like the antiques roadshow you know they want to know what's the most valuable thing we found what's the oldest thing.
[00:39:50.720]Mark Dion: But, but really people were allowed to just come and explore and walk it to our intense people like this wonderful dandy.
[00:39:59.600]Mark Dion: But this is hard work, I mean just really.
[00:40:03.960]Mark Dion: Clean all this stuff is in its enormous did hard work for our for chain, and this is like a small sample of the bones for bedside these two sides.
[00:40:15.320]Mark Dion: Are our intern there in the same city, but they have incredibly different social history right bank side has always been or the sun, the place where the where the underclass in London.
[00:40:27.760]Mark Dion: Lives right, it was always part of London, even going back to the Renaissance, were the things that would offend us the proper citizens of London vinegar factories, you know the the.
[00:40:41.000]Mark Dion: The binge drinking the horry the theater the animal games all of the stuff that was so morally offensive, which of course Steve over to everybody.
[00:40:52.320]Mark Dion: was done on bank side and so it's always been a little way the tape opening there is kind of the end of that right, so the tape is this kind of flagship of a new generation of.
[00:41:03.840]Mark Dion: gentrification which is going to change that part of London forever so that's pretty much kind of like.
[00:41:09.000]Mark Dion: undercurrent of like doing this in a sense, so, so what we're doing we're processing everything so so first we clean on the glass and we're dividing it into.
[00:41:17.800]Mark Dion: Green glass cleared once purple glass ground glass bottle necks bottled water bottles that have writing up refining refining until we run out the clock so summer's over.
[00:41:30.520]Mark Dion: Then everything takes a hiatus while I have built this enormous double sided cabinet double sided cabinet contains really like 98% will be found so.
[00:41:42.360]Mark Dion: there's good dawn's couple tires the bicycle don't make the final cut, but everything else is in there, and of course double sided.
[00:41:50.040]Mark Dion: It seems like so you're able to compare bank side and nobody, but I don't want to think that that's just too obvious right, so I don't show the same kinds of stuff so I.
[00:42:00.840]Mark Dion: I really began on frustrating your desire to get it in an easy way, and this cabinet is absolutely chock a block, it is really full.
[00:42:11.760]Mark Dion: And nothing is explained in a sense, although I do explain that I can't show you everything, so I can't show you every toy and shooting every ID card I can't show you every human tools every message in a bottle.
[00:42:24.120]Mark Dion: Every cigarette lighter industry, you know I can't so I show that I can show.
[00:42:29.480]Mark Dion: in ways that also shows that there's nothing natural or inevitable about the way that is organized that there's some subjective elements right which is, which is the artist.
[00:42:40.520]Mark Dion: And this is based on early British Museum cabinets so has this interactive element to it right, so you can pull out of drawers so you pull in a drawer and you see things are organized by the color spectrum it's plastic bottle caps.
[00:42:54.400]Mark Dion: And they're organized by venture say okay i've got i've got.
[00:42:58.400]Mark Dion: An eight over the next door and things are organized from the tiniest most human it largest and the next word it might be organized by utility these are things, these are keys and nails.
[00:43:11.280]Mark Dion: So, as you go through you find that there is no system, but their systems and what you end up with this is a sort of encyclopedia of how one might organize things.
[00:43:23.840]Mark Dion: And so, you know that that kind of interactive element is great in terms of what really activate people.
[00:43:31.400]Mark Dion: is even a greatest hits drawer see you know teeth from the bears and the bear many hits and buckles from the 17th century fragments of a meaningful life calm.
[00:43:42.840]Mark Dion: bullets from the Second World War, a contemporary voodoo doll 16th century ceramics a 400 million year old car just fossil.
[00:43:51.760]Mark Dion: And of course the needles and pens, I talked about, and then, finally, you know the last stage of this is our photographs of the team, so you know words like this involves a lot of people and often you know it's my name on the on the card right and.
[00:44:11.920]Mark Dion: No one else has been done so we don't have something like in the movies and credits and so rolls up you get.
[00:44:17.840]Mark Dion: You get to know who did the makeup we did the dry, which is the was the best board, whatever that is.
[00:44:22.920]Mark Dion: Right and so i'm always trying to figure out and we have something like this project is part, so this is kind of it and it shows.
[00:44:30.240]Mark Dion: Everyone who participated, so not also not just the volunteers, which of course is what the tape once you look forward to working people in the Community, but also people like the tape publicity guy and the assistant curator and the videographer but all of these people as well.
[00:44:52.880]Mark Dion: Now we are in San Diego California sunny San Diego so in southern California, you know, on the border there's an interesting schedule part covered to you on a slope wildlife refuge it's tiny a sandwich between the.
[00:45:10.800]Mark Dion: limpid.
[00:45:13.560]Mark Dion: I think was come to the beach.
[00:45:16.360]Mark Dion: area which a big development.
[00:45:18.960]Mark Dion: California suburbs, of course, there is the border right there, this is where when you see the pictures of the fence going into the ocean that's right here this part and it's a Jason to where the navy.
[00:45:32.600]Mark Dion: train their helicopter pilots, so you can never be in this place without you know one to five helicopters overhead sometimes with navy seals dangling from.
[00:45:41.000]Mark Dion: Also, the kids from the suburbs are riding their bmx bikes in here and the Rangers are trying to get them and, of course, support people are trying to get across the border and.
[00:45:49.880]Mark Dion: I stopped people getting close to the sample mostly restful nature reserve you ever heard of.
[00:45:55.200]Mark Dion: But if you are a bird needs to lay your hands on a beach, this is your best shot in many months right and if you're a fish needs to swim up river to river.
[00:46:06.560]Mark Dion: For all of us problems is where you're going to do that, and if your garbage eating records dunker possum.
[00:46:12.600]Mark Dion: This is where you sleeping enough in the data right, so all of these animals are kind of shoot weren't in here, as well as the birds are coming up the Western flyway right and absurd flyway.
[00:46:23.400]Mark Dion: farmland in here so it's a place with the whole history of district, you know, and it was once a garbage dump is used by the baby to test bombardments in the Second World War, so this landscape image, if I wanted to make something.
[00:46:36.800]Mark Dion: That was a structure that reflected that mischief right so i'm interested in this idea of making follies as public art live, so I mean you know the realm of public art is the area where the greatest crimes against aesthetics are committed, as you, as you all know.
[00:46:53.960]Mark Dion: So i'm always thinking what what's going to be more interesting model.
[00:46:58.200]Mark Dion: And I think you know the folly is this idea that there that you know the aristocracy created these fanciful buildings incredibly impeccably made.
[00:47:08.360]Mark Dion: which were not made for to have a practical function but we're bait jabba symbolic discursive function right, so they make meaning.
[00:47:16.200]Mark Dion: And you know there and they build religious temples to increase the picture as quality of their lands.
[00:47:23.160]Mark Dion: They created you know grottoes and they created chinoiserie structures and they created all of these places hunting, the ability to clutter the audience.
[00:47:33.640]Mark Dion: So couldn't we can we take this model away from the aristocracy me this idea of diminutive buildings that make me right, and so what's interesting for me is I can work in the public realm.
[00:47:46.440]Mark Dion: And and make something that is sculptural and architectural.
[00:47:50.600]Mark Dion: At the same time, I can also build is itself a betrayal so can contain the complexity of it as an installation artist that I go into reality so that's the big.
[00:48:00.840]Mark Dion: For me, like that all this comes together i'd be able to follow, so this one looks like a building that is this.
[00:48:07.320]Mark Dion: Is the vernacular definite shift right, it could be left over from the military could be a place where the border COPs are watching the landscape.
[00:48:17.200]Mark Dion: And you see the space you you give the park ranger a key I mean your idea, they give you a key it's a mile walk so now, my friends, we are all of this and.
[00:48:30.480]Mark Dion: And then you get to this building that site it on beautiful Bob crater and you open it up and instead of mischief you find a Mecca for bird.
[00:48:40.320]Mark Dion: So for people who are interested in Indian life they feel like they died and gone to heaven virtual summits, it has all the things burgers as maps and charts and graphs and lists all of these ways of turning you know, one of the most wonderful complex.
[00:49:01.080]Mark Dion: You know geniuses of or of organisms into statistics are into and you get and of course it's encourages you to engage with birdwatching to use the optics and the recording devices and the watercolor paper and there's a.
[00:49:20.000]Mark Dion: hall of fame people who've done a lot for Burt so people like Rachel Carson Marjorie stone of Douglas and.
[00:49:27.080]Mark Dion: Roger Jordan peterson there are these images that look like notes or try and book nature photography but they're all dead birds and.
[00:49:35.200]Mark Dion: diagram is what we don't have to tell me, and I know there's a there's some X rays of birds, who run into problems i've been rehabilitated.
[00:49:44.400]Mark Dion: Broken wings and shot or hit by cars is a chart and case want to build a bird, so this is a space that you are encouraged to just go in there and hang out.
[00:49:54.120]Mark Dion: And all the discussions in Syria, of course, about most flavor issue, which is the border and yet we're focusing on things that don't understand for our borders, we are meaningless words as one of the great things.
[00:50:08.840]Mark Dion: So, as I said, my friends in New York could see this piece, because they couldn't walk.
[00:50:13.560]Mark Dion: So I feel Denmark, so this is the urban wildlife conservation station urban wildlife, especially in it, this is built in a Madison square Park, which is the park on 23rd street across the flat our building which probably has the biodiversity wanting your parking lots here so.
[00:50:30.840]Mark Dion: So I I man's this with an incredibly talented DJ who is probably the most ignorant person with natural world i've ever really.
[00:50:42.960]Mark Dion: Good guy really a master at his craft that he actually knew nothing about.
[00:50:48.360]Mark Dion: Nature in any possible way, so so but his job was not to you know tell you anything but rather to encourage you to come in and use our resources, our our optics.
[00:51:01.400]Mark Dion: Are our books, we even have a diagram of so we change the kind of style of this to like the American museum of natural history kind of kind of coke and.
[00:51:12.400]Mark Dion: And and dark wallet would and some people would come in here and spend time and if they didn't learn enough.
[00:51:19.560]Mark Dion: They would leave with the field guide to the wildlife of Madison square Park, which has, which you know you can find thousands of these distributed.
[00:51:28.560]Mark Dion: And they have entrances or things like dogs and squirrels and engines and roaches and grass.
[00:51:36.880]Mark Dion: On the which had like fascinating network histories, which are entirely bound to our natural history and messes with mark has really interested in this, because this is kind of where the.
[00:51:46.400]Mark Dion: house better was was was kind of promoted and introduced into into her so a lot of things i'm interested in around avian life.
[00:51:58.320]Mark Dion: And you know I often and, as I said, I always start with a site, so in this case the sun is.
[00:52:06.320]Mark Dion: Is in Essen, Germany and as soon as the letter hydrology problems, so you know I wanted to work on water something around water, so I made the mistake of going to see a sort of pond or like a.
[00:52:21.120]Mark Dion: Marina in was brutal part of that work, it was cold as hell and my.
[00:52:29.040]Mark Dion: My guide and I were walking around freezing looking at this frozen Marina you know there's some birds in the middle there and we're you know practically hypothermic and you see a little construction building.
[00:52:41.640]Mark Dion: And there's smoke coming out chimney he says, I think we can can can get coffee here, so we go over and we open the door and out below cigarette smoke and rory left, right and.
[00:52:57.400]Mark Dion: You go inside and they're the people tables and there's big men and their backs in founding drinking their spouses nine o'clock in the morning right and there's a bar and grill pictures behind the bar the walls are like Carmel colors from the years of slow.
[00:53:16.280]Mark Dion: What is this place.
[00:53:19.080]Mark Dion: This is the fisherman's club is an efficient, but with his fishing season like i'm usually around end of March, April said something you guys are here, like every day talking about fish lives yeah.
[00:53:34.080]Mark Dion: Okay Now I know what I want, I want to do a competitive club, not for much.
[00:53:41.040]Mark Dion: But you know, so I worked with the and work with the Department of storage and I worked with their practices they gave me this oxygen tank and.
[00:53:53.400]Mark Dion: They build this nice hobbit door for me, we build a tower and they feel some windows, as I said, I didn't want to club for machos but for dante's so we make the amateur porn a song just one word gentle folk.
[00:54:09.880]Mark Dion: And discourse on avian lunch, so you can bring your lunch, and you can dine on our 18 feet plates instead of our cloth SOFA and and, of course, use our library and look at our specimens use the optics.
[00:54:27.600]Mark Dion: there's generally and attended better and she will introduce you to the fine art of bird observation and identification sins of freeze.
[00:54:36.840]Mark Dion: The names of people and keep track of all the birds that we see and, but it is still clubs, so it is still about drinking.
[00:54:45.280]Mark Dion: So you could drink which an electric wild Turkey or grey goose casper famous grouse Pirate Bay, you know so and you can only smoke blocks, of course.
[00:54:57.720]Mark Dion: And you know this is great, because it really is, you know it is this kind of place where you can really hang out and it's full of kitchen, Germany has amazing kids everything in the Spice relates to work.
[00:55:09.240]Mark Dion: Alright, so i'm just gonna show you one last project I can go on.
[00:55:14.160]Mark Dion: So, as I said, often my job it's a constant work and, like i'm trying to find the threat, what is it about this place that makes us some interesting new and different right and.
[00:55:22.920]Mark Dion: Maybe it's even even locals can see it, because the to close, so you bring an extra set of eyes.
[00:55:28.680]Mark Dion: To try to tease something out, so this is a technical folks can folks it is on is on in Britain it's it's on the Channel, so I want to go against France across the river across that i'm past that show.
[00:55:41.760]Mark Dion: folks in in back in the day before Amish people discovered a pizza cheap airplane flights.
[00:55:48.360]Mark Dion: People would come to folks into to vacation and so their grand hotel says we're like the Prince of Wales will bring his mistress, and this is where.
[00:55:57.200]Mark Dion: People like Bernard Shaw hg wells had summer house that's right, this is it has great bones, and it fell on very hard times after after that time.
[00:56:07.400]Mark Dion: You know throughout you know pretty much the later part of the 20th century really super depressed they're also had a very vibrant fishing industry that was destroyed by really bad fishing management and overfishing.
[00:56:19.360]Mark Dion: So is a is a state of faded seaside town, which I understand pretty well I also come from.
[00:56:25.640]Mark Dion: A the seaside town, so I thought i'd recognize a lot about this, but there's one thing I didn't recognize, which is that people were vehemently.
[00:56:34.800]Mark Dion: hateful of seagulls like we talked about see you know if you go to Arizona and we're just wants to talk about water, you know where you go to New York and we're just wants to talk about real estate, but this year, everyone just wants to see like how horrible right, and so I thought.
[00:56:51.960]Mark Dion: That was one of course people hated the girls, because some people love to go too much right and they feed the ducks those are super smart they're really flexible behavior so they learn to associate people with food.
[00:57:04.200]Mark Dion: And you know there's there's a Gal who understands how the Tesco electronic door works so she just walks in she takes some bags of chips.
[00:57:15.600]Mark Dion: Christmas, I would say you brings them out and opens them for all of her friends like she doesn't understand how capitalism works, but she doesn't understand how.
[00:57:24.360]Mark Dion: The tool works, and you know the girls understand like on Friday we're getting fish and chips, and if you do around the corner at 60 miles an hour, if not the chips out of their hands.
[00:57:33.480]Mark Dion: they'll come in seems like they're making dinner so seagulls really have a PR problem something once eagles need is.
[00:57:42.480]Mark Dion: A mobile go appreciation unit, so the motel appreciation unit travels around the city of Boston and by highly knowledgeable roles assigned to the protection of birds trained.
[00:57:56.760]Mark Dion: Attendance talk to people to try to convince them that seagulls aren't got rats with wings but they're really significant animals, and so we hit all the hotspot and what we found.
[00:58:07.840]Mark Dion: After doing this was that people actually don't or not everyone is like the girl haters are a noise need minority.
[00:58:16.760]Mark Dion: The tea party or something like it's not actually that bad they just really noisy smell, and what we find is that people really love the girls and then lucky but stories of the hand raising goals are rescuing goals and so.
[00:58:30.720]Mark Dion: So it actually turned out to be surprisingly positive project in that you didn't have to be as evangelicals I have to be and.
[00:58:41.960]Mark Dion: And of course we need a guide, which talks about the bills that are there because it's like Julius very southern spot we get a lot of extra bells there will learn different calls that you might have to find other parts of England and also.
[00:58:53.520]Mark Dion: While it may not be possible to speak, though it is possible to understand a lot of girls you're talking.
[00:58:59.840]Mark Dion: About just have studied bells really extensively and so you can learn, you can even figure out a lot of book go vocalizations or meaning.
[00:59:09.400]Mark Dion: called body language is and this guide to kind of help you help introduce you to go culture so i'm zillion more things I can show you that that's all we have time for some Thank you.
[00:59:34.400]Mark Dion: yeah Thank you very much, mark, I think we can ask some questions people have any questions I just i'll start it off hope people are formulating their questions and ask you to talk a little bit more about movements lane again residency program you work and you're there.
[00:59:52.440]Mark Dion: So if you were here for the pre show right you sound other these images of this thing called builders like they'll just like is a.
[01:00:00.040]Mark Dion: artist residency program that I co founded with the artist Morgan putin's was a fashion designer and artist and it's a beach like Pennsylvania, is a remarkable place for people that are really interested in.
[01:00:13.880]Mark Dion: project based art and collaborative art it's not one of these residency is where you come and they give you the basic studio and they knock.
[01:00:20.520]Mark Dion: On your door feed you lunch is a place where you leave your own ideas at the door and you come to.
[01:00:26.720]Mark Dion: me with a master or team usually most often team so could be an architect in a sociologist or an artist and a forger and there are topics like next year i'm leading a session with the artists and videos called flea market.
[01:00:44.040]Mark Dion: Which is going to look at the history of artists using flea markets and will culminate with the participants.
[01:00:51.120]Mark Dion: renting tables at the flea market to show their work or whatever they want to share right so it's a really dynamic super interesting place to meet artists from all over the world and people come from all over the world to participate in this it's not enormous.
[01:01:05.680]Mark Dion: And we should talk to you because a lot of schools sent students my distance people and we send people in our industry is that people.
[01:01:16.880]Mark Dion: aren't supposed to send people Columbia send people so it's an interesting program that really allows.
[01:01:24.080]Mark Dion: I think would be an interesting program here, because you know there's a lot of community of artists here.
[01:01:28.880]Mark Dion: But maybe don't have a lot of connections to artists from other parts of the world, so it's a great place for that to happen and you've come on your own or you come with a school or there's a lot of ways, so please look into I spoke mildred slay.
[01:01:44.640]Mark Dion: Thank you, thank you any any questions yeah.
[01:01:55.800]Mark Dion: You do have to pay but it's Sorry, I have to repeat the question further zoom so question is, you have to pay to the fluency yeah you did have to pay, and there are some scholarships and but it's you know, compared to other residents in some places.
[01:02:14.680]Mark Dion: You know other times you know i've been saying, like.
[01:02:19.480]Mark Dion: we're far lower scale and a lot of you that's stuck again or or you know something like that yeah.
[01:02:28.760]Mark Dion: Yes.
[01:02:30.400]Mark Dion: happens to the installations.
[01:02:37.160]Mark Dion: What happens to the installations in shows it really depends now under the best circumstances they're bought by insanely wealthy people take care of forever.
[01:02:48.320]Mark Dion: or institutions that that certainly doesn't happen all the time, so very often they are suspended and sometimes work pieces aren't they get recycled, so the elements might find that there are some elements that have been five or six different solutions.
[01:03:06.600]Mark Dion: Ideally, you know I like to work a little.
[01:03:09.600]Mark Dion: gem, if I could go on for another two hours, I would have shown projects that are more permanent and I also really prefer to work in that way, so, for instance, the folks did.
[01:03:19.440]Mark Dion: These is permanent, but they have a list and they take it out every time this is done for triennial so every three years, they we.
[01:03:39.120]Mark Dion: yeah.
[01:04:10.360]Mark Dion: I mean, in a way we don't know I mean they certainly can replace other treats but we won't you know you won't see that kind of force in our life right, so you can take all the spaces that.
[01:04:25.320]Mark Dion: ash for.
[01:04:27.240]Mark Dion: created and book kinko's and maybe you know your children's children will see them.
[01:04:33.960]Mark Dion: In the state of the ashes were in or maybe not you know I mean what i'm interested in is what happens when you.
[01:04:40.840]Mark Dion: You know, take entire geniuses out of the picture and there is nothing to you know somebody will fill in but it won't be as rich and we'll have the diversity and you know.
[01:04:55.080]Mark Dion: So playing with ketosis is you know, taking a species from the other side of the world solving right so that I mean, these are really interesting is interesting issues or problems, you know.
[01:05:11.040]Mark Dion: Thank you for that talk when i'm really interested in the components of the work that you've discussed that rotate around kind of a public natural history.
[01:05:21.600]Mark Dion: And i'm curious about that part of your methodology, because so many of esports like the field guide the cabinet of curiosities kind of harkens back to moments in the history of science, where you have a pretty extreme separation between, who is a scientist who is.
[01:05:41.880]Mark Dion: And who is an artist student movement sense and it feels like some of that is getting undermined did over the interesting way because of its public.
[01:05:52.040]Mark Dion: So i'm curious about how people have reacted to being asked to learn about seagulls or riches or anything like that, like what is it eat.
[01:06:05.160]Mark Dion: It eat it is tricky because a lot of my work and often you know, sometimes i'm doing projects that are out of videos in one dashboard or or sometimes a person in a very often i'll work about a biologist like.
[01:06:22.040]Mark Dion: We have marcher Rachel Carson so or you know, whoever, but I have this burden and I worked on catch people up.
[01:06:30.240]Mark Dion: Because if they dumped out Rachel Carson is in a little way they're not gonna they're not going to get anything out so so in some sense I sympathize with the natural history to supply because.
[01:06:41.200]Mark Dion: You do have you have this burp like Okay, let me give you let me give you a little information on web visits before you see it, so you get a little more into it um.
[01:06:51.480]Mark Dion: it's it's an interesting couple given one of the things that I mean for me, like the field guides are part of the solution to that right, because the field guide, can you feel is really based on these early the beginning of.
[01:07:06.200]Mark Dion: The 20th century and of the next century, you would you would you be cm you wouldn't be reading wall texts, you would you know spend five cents or.
[01:07:16.080]Mark Dion: to buy a little guide and that would tell you what was in every gallery and that would that would essentially have the same function.
[01:07:22.520]Mark Dion: And you can also take that home, so what I like about these is that they they serve do that in a way, they do a lot of that heavy lifting didactic stuff.
[01:07:33.280]Mark Dion: um and at the same time, you can take it back and look at it in another way, so you know I don't I don't think anyone likes the experience of reading textbooks.
[01:07:43.520]Mark Dion: Blue towards right so so so that's kind of part of it and yeah you're right, I am trying to is trying to hijack the language of natural history partially from a political perspective, but also partially from the perspective of love reading.
[01:08:02.040]Mark Dion: I get a lot from these places and i've learned a lot from the spices and where I may have.
[01:08:07.640]Mark Dion: Strategic arguments and and and certainly happy to point out some of the past mistakes, I also happy to celebrate the successes right so so you know I want that kind of.
[01:08:21.040]Mark Dion: not interested in you only speak with a particular condemning critical voice, although I might my work to be critical, so you know it's there's many ways to.
[01:08:34.080]Mark Dion: get there, so.
[01:08:35.880]Mark Dion: there's an interesting set of possibilities here because it folks maybe a different kind of understanding or relation to.
[01:08:45.480]Mark Dion: Like a natural world that is now in a kind of constant accelerating state of change right Apps you know this field guides I think were invented with the idea that, like.
[01:08:55.480]Mark Dion: You could come back and return to all above right species feature Defense so you don't miss in terms of really interesting because they really work about.
[01:09:06.040]Mark Dion: You know, creating for a more general public as a sense of appreciation and love and empathy you know, I think, but in terms of.
[01:09:16.680]Mark Dion: The hardest working at this moment it's really like all hands on deck right like.
[01:09:23.280]Mark Dion: yeah we need those people take photographs from national geographic and try to build empathy and we need those artists scientists like random value James you're really the biologists solve the problem, we need those.
[01:09:35.920]Mark Dion: artists who are working with engineers to try to solve problems that we need.
[01:09:41.120]Mark Dion: People like the lenses rodwin to depict what happens if we get it wrong, you know, and you know it's really an end for me like why part of that puzzle is.
[01:09:51.080]Mark Dion: The person who is looking kind of history of science and trying to figure out how exactly did we evolve this suicidal relationship to the world right right so so that's my part of it, but I think we need everybody and we don't you definitely don't need to be.
[01:10:07.800]Mark Dion: warring against each other.
[01:10:10.000]Mark Dion: You know i'm very.
[01:10:12.400]Mark Dion: tolerant of other approaches.
[01:10:17.720]Mark Dion: Thank you very much, I think we have any more question one more.
[01:10:23.960]Mark Dion: Okay, yes.
[01:10:50.360]Mark Dion: was your intent to educated about the subjects that you're you're talking.
[01:10:58.520]Mark Dion: But I think it's interesting is actually the by the first work I did was way more didactic in a way, it was very like on the nose.
[01:11:07.920]Mark Dion: To.
[01:11:09.520]Mark Dion: An arsenal because night at that, when I was a young artist, I thought that the.
[01:11:16.600]Mark Dion: global ecological crisis biodiversity versus, what are we going to call it is was an information crisis sounds like well clearly if people do.
[01:11:27.120]Mark Dion: Then they would modify their grandparents be all right it's so obvious that that's not the case right it's not a major crisis, you know it is.
[01:11:37.560]Mark Dion: A crisis of will and culture and leadership and all these other things that are so much more complicated, so I think.
[01:11:46.920]Mark Dion: These words have you're right, I mean they they are educational and they're also playing with that as as a form of it up and hijacking aspects of that, but at the same time, you know I think they're not as.
[01:12:02.800]Mark Dion: pointed and preach it as they want score you know, there are a lot more to play flow and I think that's largely because.
[01:12:11.120]Mark Dion: The information is out there and other sources and it's it's almost impossible to avoid.
[01:12:19.080]Mark Dion: there's one more you get the team to assemble your up someplace for a month and a half and how do you figure out the right team if people need the team inside, what do you see Thank you take scape room yeah yeah they're talking about.
[01:12:37.240]Mark Dion: How do you get your team and what do you do.
[01:12:39.920]Mark Dion: So I don't have like a studio where I have like people working for me, but sometimes I do big projects and I need a group of people, so I have a lot of friends who are artists like like in the event space.
[01:12:51.000]Mark Dion: You see, I brought together all of these people who, who I know a door and like to spend time with and so.
[01:12:58.600]Mark Dion: You know I have people who are sculptors if people were painters, I have people who are looking to show you.
[01:13:06.240]Mark Dion: Projects where we're doing you know we're kind of making something like 19th century natural history, it was Richard side I needed to watercolor.
[01:13:15.320]Mark Dion: And so we usually move on location in those cases, sometimes the openness to do the work and you just build stuff.
[01:13:22.840]Mark Dion: close to them, but most often we work on site, because I hate part shipping, which is a wasteful particular.
[01:13:29.840]Mark Dion: Is that we make something on site we simplify simplify it we always cook for each other in the old days, what we do is we, the first thing we do is we go to like a thrift store and we find that the old vcr and like a giant stack of course.
[01:13:44.520]Mark Dion: And so we hang out together at night, good for each other drinking couple bottles of wine.
[01:13:51.920]Mark Dion: And you know we also look, you know everyone's well paid everyone gets days off to enjoy place so you know we kind of create a video culture that.
[01:14:04.640]Mark Dion: You know, we work really hard but it's also, it has to be fun everyone.
[01:14:10.480]Mark Dion: I know everyone on the team side, I met there's not a jerk on the team, everyone is very generous and also be trying to do, half the team from from plants, so we worked in Norway.
[01:14:23.040]Mark Dion: Making the bear den so we actually had an abandoned supermarket is our studio, and so we had four people from from New York.
[01:14:34.200]Mark Dion: And doors from from.
[01:14:36.440]Mark Dion: Florence, but it had four people foot states, and we have four people from Norway and Sweden, and so we have a big house.
[01:14:50.400]Mark Dion: Thank you very much.
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