Noel Anderson - Hixson-Lied Visiting Artist
School of Art, Art History & Design
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04/12/2021
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Noel Anderson
Hixson-Lied Visiting Artist
04-07-2021
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Noel W Anderson is a Professor in New York University’s Art and Art Professions Department, and Area Head of Printmedia. Originally from Louisville, KY, he holds a Bachelor of Fine Arts from Ohio Wesleyan University, a Master of Fine Arts from Indiana University in Printmaking, and a Master of Fine Arts from Yale University in Sculpture. Anderson has been awarded a NYFA Fellowship in visual art, a Jerome Prize, and a Camargo Residency. In 2018, he completed a major residency at Dieu Donne Papermaking
in Brooklyn, NY; and he recently completed an artist-in-residence position at Tamarind Lithography Workshop. Anderson’s 2019, traveling exhibition and catalogue, Blak Origin Moment, received an Artforum “critic’s pick,” among other reviews. His essay “Confederacies, Tensilities, Fugitivities: Those Eyes”, co-authored with Andrew Weiner, was published in October Journal, summer 2018. Anderson’s text, “Echoes from the Hole,” published in e-flux- Journal, spring 2019, continued his research into the political aesthetics of racial capitalism; while his essay “Schien, Schein Negro Sun: Black Radical Radiance,” exploring black subjectivity’s interiority, was published in Effects Art Journal fall 2019. Anderson’s works have been exhibited at The Hunter Museum of American Art, The
Contemporary Art Center (Cincinnati, OH), The Studio Museum in Harlem (NYC),
Tilton Gallery (NYC), Zidoun/Bossuyt (Luxembourg), and 1-54 Contemporary
African Art Fair with Galerie Anne de Villepoix. In 2021, Anderson will open his solo exhibition, Heavy is the Crown, at Telfair Museums located in Savannah, Georgia.
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- [00:00:02.560]Perry Obee: And I just will start off also by saying that no and I have known each other, I can't believe this, we were just talking about it going on 20 years I don't know if I should even say that it's insane.
- [00:00:14.240]Perry Obee: And we've had the fortune to run across each other throughout that time in different different places.
- [00:00:20.560]Perry Obee: know was you know know when you when we read oh whoo together back you know almost 20 years ago no is this.
- [00:00:28.160]Perry Obee: upperclassmen who is always in the studio work in our Professor was always like you gotta check out with this guy knows doing and.
- [00:00:35.520]Perry Obee: i'd say you know you've always been a big inspiration to me no I mean even from back then I would say that you made printmaking something that fascinated me, you know, I was like what is this thing this guy's serious about it, and I want to be serious about it, too, so.
- [00:00:53.160]Perry Obee: Those been incredibly giving to my our students here at ul he's met with both graduate students and the undergraduate students he's worked extensively with both of them.
- [00:01:04.480]Perry Obee: Some really fancy fantastic projects he's developed with some of the undergraduate students and I just know that they've all benefited a huge amount already from those visit.
- [00:01:14.440]Perry Obee: And so i'm really looking forward to what know has to share tonight and sharing you know, with all of you, with you all so with that i'm gonna turn it over to you now.
- [00:01:26.600]Noel Anderson: cool cool cool cool cool.
- [00:01:29.880]Noel Anderson: Can they see me.
- [00:01:31.000]Perry Obee: I think so.
- [00:01:36.800]Noel Anderson: going in.
- [00:01:52.800]Noel Anderson: share the screen there we go.
- [00:02:00.760]Noel Anderson: So can we see this screen.
- [00:02:30.320]Noel Anderson: Going somewhere tonight.
- [00:02:35.680]Noel Anderson: you give me like another minute on a song and i'm not to cut this off and we don't go.
- [00:03:02.440]Noel Anderson: song so easy.
- [00:03:09.000]Noel Anderson: it's just a fun song and you feel it.
- [00:03:12.480]Noel Anderson: Okay let's.
- [00:03:16.080]Noel Anderson: boo it's just so there I say brilliant brilliant man, you know.
- [00:03:23.960]Noel Anderson: I just want to say, first and foremost.
- [00:03:26.440]Noel Anderson: Thank you for inviting me parried I was touched, it was still in touch by the words that you gave me.
- [00:03:34.120]Noel Anderson: matter of fact, my emotions are about to go where words can't go I can't describe what what what you said to me did to me so, all I can say, maybe should be Otis we could do it better, I also want to thank nebraska university for bringing me Lincoln.
- [00:03:49.240]Noel Anderson: You know I like corn is cool The funny thing is my aunt one of my aunt and uncle lived in Lincoln for 40 something years.
- [00:03:58.720]Noel Anderson: I remember driving from louisville Kentucky in the back of a station wagon to Lincoln nebraska waving at cars, all the way you know.
- [00:04:07.480]Noel Anderson: So there we go all right so yeah i'm no w Anderson, thank you for having me I was going to try something a little different tonight, let me, let me marginalize this on my screen, so I don't have to stare at my face very good.
- [00:04:19.720]Noel Anderson: And there's something that's been happening in my studio lately that I want to share that I actually think emerged out of everything I was doing probably from.
- [00:04:33.000]Noel Anderson: Grad actually know probably from undergrad to the day, and that is like wrestling with let's see there we go wrestling with images.
- [00:04:42.240]Noel Anderson: Right wrestling with images and I just want to confirm, one more time, we can see this right.
- [00:04:48.720]Noel Anderson: Alright cool.
- [00:04:49.120]Perry Obee: Yes, yep yep you're good.
- [00:04:50.480]Noel Anderson: you're sure okay.
- [00:04:52.720]Noel Anderson: So uh.
- [00:04:54.760]Noel Anderson: I grew up with with these kind of archives of blackness in my life right I grew up with these images, whether was ebony magazine or was jet magazine.
- [00:05:04.880]Noel Anderson: Right, you would go to the Center phone like who's just centerfold of the week, or you know or the month or whatever, and it was amazing to experience.
- [00:05:13.000]Noel Anderson: The kind of cornucopia or what I thought at the time was the cornucopia of blackness and i've been trying to wrestle with how those images that I grew up with or those archives of those sources that I grew up with um.
- [00:05:27.640]Noel Anderson: define who I am how they develop the contours, that is what we call no w Anderson right like like if we if we just look at this image I think to myself well this man must be successful, but then you know years down the line we figure out who he really was right.
- [00:05:44.880]Noel Anderson: So when I was in Grad school, the second time.
- [00:05:49.120]Noel Anderson: You should ask me about that, when I was in Grad school, the second time I used to buy.
- [00:05:55.840]Noel Anderson: ebony magazine's in bulk right this before the the brilliant for a minute both the aggregates purchased up the whole lot and then Google or yeah yeah yeah it right.
- [00:06:06.520]Noel Anderson: This is before all that you could buy any magazines and both for like 20 bucks so you could buy like 4050 magazines for $20 off of eBay and I was buying them at info at 9am and I was just spending all my money.
- [00:06:17.080]Noel Anderson: You know, as a Grad student thinking of this check that the Uncle Sam gave me was real didn't realize, I had to pay it back.
- [00:06:24.400]Noel Anderson: So what ended up happening is I turned around the studio one day and I had maybe 200 of these ebony magazine's and I had to figure out how to make them make sense, you know you don't want to buy something.
- [00:06:33.640]Noel Anderson: And then think oh I wasted it, you know or hoard things like a lot of artists do so, I had to make it make sense and when looking at these magazine pages, I was kind of stunned.
- [00:06:44.880]Noel Anderson: You know by the reality that was in front of me that if we look at this ebony magazine page for 1970.
- [00:06:52.360]Noel Anderson: We have a little child smiling with a wig next to a child on there then that's on the left side of the page we look at the close up on the right side.
- [00:07:01.080]Noel Anderson: We have a child smiling with a wig and then on the left side of that close up, we have another child crying next to his mother right this child being been changing whose brother was one of the three civil rights.
- [00:07:12.640]Noel Anderson: Workers murdered in Mississippi right, so I was interested I realized that there were a multiplicity of blackness is our black subjectivity is available in this book right.
- [00:07:25.000]Noel Anderson: But then I got to there we go, then I got to these images and started to realize that there was something wrong for me that the image on a very basic level on a material level was nothing but ink on paper.
- [00:07:40.600]Noel Anderson: And as soon as I thought that you know I thought well it's not real right and we'll get back to what is what is reality and what is not at the end, I would hope.
- [00:07:48.600]Noel Anderson: Because when I say it's not real it's a lot deeper than just it's not a tangible thing it's not a believable thing it's a lot deeper than that.
- [00:07:55.040]Noel Anderson: I started to realize that the image itself every go at the image itself was not really it was just a series of materials.
- [00:08:03.040]Noel Anderson: And because of that it was a series of ink thoughts on paper, I could I could imagine it to be anything but in order to imagine it to be anything I had to strip it.
- [00:08:14.920]Noel Anderson: let's see if this works there you go, so what you've seen is the same image right she's mean.
- [00:08:22.120]Noel Anderson: stripped so I started working with this method that you know I think is very much akin to a kind of rauschenberg VI de kooning you know ratzenberger raises the day kooning it takes them forever to do it.
- [00:08:35.320]Noel Anderson: In a sense, he's trying to either it's not kind of an edible killing but it's kind of challenging of the archive In this sense, to cooney the archive right.
- [00:08:43.320]Noel Anderson: And I think the same way, I think, well, if I can erase the image, then I can challenge the idea of the of this kind of subject within the black archive.
- [00:08:54.080]Noel Anderson: So I started initially erasing these images with erasers literally erasers and that was just a lot of work.
- [00:09:00.760]Noel Anderson: That was just way too much work for me right, my arm was hurting I was like my God rauschenberg I see why you only did one.
- [00:09:07.600]Noel Anderson: But then I figured it out there's got to be another way, so I started mixing this chemical a series of chemicals together, which I will not tell you.
- [00:09:14.640]Noel Anderson: And it allowed me to strip the ink a lot faster right and it also allowed me to take the image into a territory of the painterly like if we look at Perry, can you hear me.
- [00:09:28.240]Perry Obee: Yes, I hear you yeah and you.
- [00:09:29.600]Noel Anderson: Also, you all can see this cursor now.
- [00:09:31.600]Noel Anderson: yep see it.
- [00:09:34.200]Noel Anderson: So when i'm talking about like you know when I was stripping the image are basically racing right let's let's do let's go there any racing with the chemical it wasn't just a racing with a.
- [00:09:42.960]Noel Anderson: rag and some water it's literally taking a paintbrush dipping into this.
- [00:09:46.240]Noel Anderson: Chemical and then move either removing ink right we look at the original removing all of that ink or strategically and carefully erasing it we go back to the eyelashes.
- [00:09:57.920]Noel Anderson: You racing that ink and keeping you know aspects of the feature or the of the physical form right of the body that identify as as.
- [00:10:07.840]Noel Anderson: Well, not female but identify as human um but still, in a way, seem to be abstract right because there's, a thing that starts to happen in the next image showing right.
- [00:10:20.720]Noel Anderson: that's that seems to be getting me closer to this idea of.
- [00:10:26.800]Noel Anderson: All territory at the edge of vision.
- [00:10:31.120]Noel Anderson: And i'll get there when I get there, so continuing with this line of thought I was finding a bunch of advertisements from any magazines and I was racing him and and, quite frankly, I was racing there we go I was erasing and manipulating them.
- [00:10:48.920]Noel Anderson: One because I had the resources to because I really wanted to deal with the archive on it's very basic level, which was this page minus the image.
- [00:10:56.560]Noel Anderson: And I wanted to think that, if I could erase the image, then I can project any any imagined subject or subjectivity in that cause I blank space.
- [00:11:06.760]Noel Anderson: Now I call it acquires I blank space, because you know, sometimes, as if with this one right, we still have traces.
- [00:11:15.280]Noel Anderson: Of the image right and we could pick that up with a kind of Derek derridean logic about the trace or the vestige everything has its kind of ontology and there's a way in which i'm interested in in the trace of or the history of a kind of trauma, if you will, well, like that.
- [00:11:35.920]Noel Anderson: let's go there let's go there you'll notice with the works that i'm very much into how language plays right, so instead of erasing the whole page.
- [00:11:46.240]Noel Anderson: In this way, I like how check the skin kind of acts as a pedestal for the eraser of a particular kind of representation of black femininity right.
- [00:11:58.200]Noel Anderson: I think these two works are included in a show that just open today.
- [00:12:03.480]Noel Anderson: called promise witness remembrance at the speed art museum curated by the brilliant allison Glenn guess curated.
- [00:12:15.440]Noel Anderson: And in that show it has the centerpiece painting of brianna Taylor and it's it's essentially a show that really tries to glorify her life.
- [00:12:25.040]Noel Anderson: admits the eraser of it by anti black violence, so all of that kind of conversation of what does it mean for the black female to be erased.
- [00:12:34.880]Noel Anderson: Right, what does it mean to erase oneself and then desire to project another kind of becoming onto that surface all of that is embedded in what i'm trying to I was trying to do at the time with these images right because some of those 70 images are.
- [00:12:51.240]Noel Anderson: Are erased to a point, but then drawing and printing is done back on top of those.
- [00:12:58.720]Noel Anderson: So all of those were occurring and let's see that that's that's let's go chronologically I guess that's oh nine I started doing the ebony works in oh nine.
- [00:13:08.880]Noel Anderson: And okay yeah and then here comes here comes what what I hit new boom boom boom there we go here comes what you know we might call that paradigm shift, or what what I would call the event the break um.
- [00:13:22.760]Noel Anderson: I would you know i'm gonna i'm gonna bare my soul to you people tonight because we're family.
- [00:13:28.720]Noel Anderson: So please, please be patient, while I try to get this emotional space out and thank you for making a safe space for me.
- [00:13:38.320]Noel Anderson: My dear friend and i've told the story before, but my dear friend jack tilden used to tell me.
- [00:13:44.200]Noel Anderson: know you should go to the met on Friday nights and I would be like yo jack what the Fuck I go whenever I want and i'm going to go in on Friday I go on a Thursday, it was a Friday.
- [00:13:51.320]Noel Anderson: And he would say you know, and this was like 10 years ago he would say you know, on Fridays.
- [00:13:55.880]Noel Anderson: it's a big deal because you know artists go and not a lot of tours are there and then you could like hanging out with other artists, so I would go and.
- [00:14:02.200]Noel Anderson: I would fanboy you know much like some people I G, so I was fanboy with boy with Susan whale brilliant artists.
- [00:14:09.160]Noel Anderson: I was fan boring with like I was like walking through the African Union seeing a Richard total i'm like Richard totals over you're staring at a fucking rock or something.
- [00:14:16.440]Noel Anderson: And I would think to myself well why do I want to stare at Richard stare at a rock here to figure that out like rauschenberg says about Duchamp Why would I want to help him.
- [00:14:24.000]Noel Anderson: So I go and find something to stab myself, so I go to the media going and start staring at tapestries.
- [00:14:29.680]Noel Anderson: Right, I was just mesmerized by these images, I was just I don't know why stupefied and bewildered by the likes of it, these huge images that are woven with thread that look like painting but they're not quite painting.
- [00:14:43.880]Noel Anderson: What is that about.
- [00:14:46.280]Noel Anderson: And then I realized it's about photography and representation proper.
- [00:14:52.320]Noel Anderson: I realized that.
- [00:14:54.400]Noel Anderson: Peter Paul rubens makes a painting.
- [00:14:57.760]Noel Anderson: Right, he makes the small cartoon and then he gives it to the weaving Guild and the weaving you'll start weaving this big monstrosity of a tapestry right for the patron right patron saint.
- [00:15:09.960]Noel Anderson: But then the weavers come back to Peter Paul said, my do we can't make these tapestries no mo and he said.
- [00:15:16.360]Noel Anderson: SWAT and is it because your paintings are to nuance we can't transition from those flesh tones to those dark fly those shadows, we can't do it is too much.
- [00:15:24.560]Noel Anderson: he's like whatever finished the project and get out my face i'm about to go over here to the print lab and i'm going to have them take this image and mass produce it at info at nighttime right.
- [00:15:33.760]Noel Anderson: All of a sudden that image has it has has gone through three iterations right, it was a painting probably a drawing to which makes it for.
- [00:15:41.080]Noel Anderson: Drawing painting to text out filter through print and then I can easily say you know it gets filtered into photography in a heartbeat right, I thought, all of those things are actually happening in this one image.
- [00:15:54.480]Noel Anderson: That broke me and then I thought okay well what's the other connection I said okay well the dude.
- [00:15:59.920]Noel Anderson: To card who invents particular kind of way of weaving Dzhokhar weaving introduces the punch car registration, which is essentially area, the beginning of binary code.
- [00:16:08.760]Noel Anderson: And then, Charles babbage picks all that up and invest the grandfather of the computer stock it so every time i'm staring at a screen i'm staring at a weaving.
- [00:16:18.160]Noel Anderson: Man broke me open broke me open seismic shift a whole nother way of thinking about images man like like like Nina Simone says a whole nother way of be.
- [00:16:31.320]Noel Anderson: that's what i'm after and how I get there, how do I get there, so we get get there here, you know oh 920 10 for my first show in New York.
- [00:16:42.880]Noel Anderson: At tilden curated by jack tilden the end of the brilliant Derek Adams Hello hello to the board Eric Adams my my home.
- [00:16:51.640]Noel Anderson: And this was an image that I had I had done this, like the same kind of filtration system really.
- [00:16:57.080]Noel Anderson: I made the image in photoshop, which is essentially a photo composite of Martin Luther King jr and the to Kennedy brothers all three assassinated in the same decade.
- [00:17:05.960]Noel Anderson: i've been sent it to an age regression or progression company they aged him, and this was before I knew how to do it myself right.
- [00:17:13.440]Noel Anderson: And then I sent it to the weavers and they wove it right, I thought well damn I I have so much control over the image and, at the time.
- [00:17:19.720]Noel Anderson: My father had passed away the year before, and I think I really do think I was trying to grapple with what it meant to lose that man, while also trying to ante up and go back to Grad school at Yale man, I had double messed myself.
- [00:17:36.080]Noel Anderson: i've been circled back to the image, the way I was dealing with.
- [00:17:41.600]Noel Anderson: When I was dealing with the ebony pages.
- [00:17:45.040]Noel Anderson: and realize well the tapestry itself is nothing but a bunch of threads of material let's just attack it, so I started attacking them this way coding them in huge.
- [00:17:54.520]Noel Anderson: layers of polyester polyurethane foam sanding them down dyeing them, you know.
- [00:18:01.120]Noel Anderson: embedding materials in them, so, if you look closely here, I might actually have a close up in a second here is like glass slides that I had in bed I physically embedded in the in the.
- [00:18:12.160]Noel Anderson: polyurethane you know it's kind of like a molding mold making method right, I think, at the time I was reading a lot about.
- [00:18:19.920]Noel Anderson: michelangelo's later sculptures where the the farms are the figures are emerging out of the marble and he dies before you can finish finish them so there's this beautiful kind of moment kind of.
- [00:18:31.840]Noel Anderson: Sharon burrata and moment where those two forms are entangled where you don't know if the figure is coming out emerging or are slumbering back into the form that was interesting and I was interested in doing that, with these works right.
- [00:18:43.520]Noel Anderson: And the images also come from coloring books right, so you can't really see it so well, but here's a I you know, while staying up late and buying all those ebony magazine's I also stayed up late.
- [00:18:56.960]Noel Anderson: And bought coloring books, like a fat Albert coloring book cost me $100 with them and I had to have it, you know, and it has served me well.
- [00:19:04.320]Noel Anderson: So this is an image from fat Albert coloring book for those who don't know fat Albert you know bill cosby fat Albert do the research and the image is basically a white boy, on top of a.
- [00:19:16.960]Noel Anderson: horse, and this is the horse's Mane he's standing on top of a horse why black child is leading the horse it's a very bizarre image and there's a whole slew of critiques we could have in there about.
- [00:19:29.880]Noel Anderson: What does it mean for the father will call him bill cosby right he the prototypical Father bill cosby to usher us your your your your subjective you usher you into blackness with images of overweight black man right and overnight an overweight black teenager.
- [00:19:46.240]Noel Anderson: Right, a child who can't speak English properly they call him much mouth yeah what does it mean to sit at the TV and watch those things right, so it made total sense to me.
- [00:19:58.840]Noel Anderson: To take images that I received from the screen and then turn them into weaving right, so if we look closely, we can see.
- [00:20:06.680]Noel Anderson: Excuse me, we look closely, we can see the glass slides that are embedded as well as some kind of some wiring structures that I was using and it was also really nice at the time, because I had a studio.
- [00:20:18.640]Noel Anderson: In Cincinnati Ohio and I was a professor there and thing was huge colossal and I would go down to the basement of that studio and that guy had you know all kinds of wiring in the dumpster man, it was a dumpster divers dumpster divers paradise in there, you know.
- [00:20:35.360]Excuse me, little water moving.
- [00:20:41.200]Noel Anderson: How we doing on time very.
- [00:20:44.920]Perry Obee: Good okay just making sure you're all good we got plenty of time.
- [00:20:49.320]Okay.
- [00:20:51.160]Noel Anderson: So after doing.
- [00:20:53.000]Noel Anderson: Some of those fat Albert works for a while of.
- [00:20:55.200]Noel Anderson: A year or two, I think.
- [00:20:57.520]Noel Anderson: I was lucky enough.
- [00:21:00.080]Noel Anderson: To get an exhibition.
- [00:21:05.120]Noel Anderson: Actually let's go back cuz I just realized something let's do this like I do in class when I realized things I go back let's let's go back real quick.
- [00:21:11.200]Noel Anderson: I just realized, something that that makes makes total sense now when i'm thinking about austerity or blackness at the edge of vision what i'm talking about is is this i'm talking about the ways in which hegemonic structures don't allow you to realize who you really are.
- [00:21:31.880]Noel Anderson: i'm talking about the ways in which you are marginalized and it's not just black folks with a whole lot of folks in this world who get marginalized and pushed to the edge.
- [00:21:39.640]Noel Anderson: Right, as such, when they get marginalized you either get pushed to the edge, or you get reduced to you know, a Labor or something like that, when that occurs, you are abstracted.
- [00:21:49.120]Noel Anderson: Right and I try i'm trying to a line that kind of term that social form of abstraction the reducing people to.
- [00:21:58.240]Noel Anderson: To almost not human if not two not human by the neck or political structure right i'm trying to align that with abstraction proper, which is like you know abstract expressionism as something because there's a way in which.
- [00:22:13.360]Noel Anderson: abstract expressionism in itself.
- [00:22:19.840]Noel Anderson: How would I say this without crossing too many lines ooh ooh.
- [00:22:24.840]Noel Anderson: ooh there's a way in which abstract expressionism also reduces oh reduces out black people's and you know women.
- [00:22:30.960]Noel Anderson: So there's there's there seems to be a kind of shadowing or paralleling for me in the way i'm thinking about the way social structures of political structures abstract us.
- [00:22:40.240]Noel Anderson: Right and keep us at an edge of visibility, where we still remain abstract in their in their vision right, you know it's like it's like.
- [00:22:49.680]Noel Anderson: it's like we're a blur we're not fully realized in their mind and i'm thinking that all of that is it was occurring for me in this work up to this point right So even if i'm thinking about the way in which.
- [00:23:02.080]Noel Anderson: I put the polyurethane on some of this stuff and sand the sand or obscured right or short imagery or force the audience to bend down to see this glass slide of a black penis.
- [00:23:12.760]Noel Anderson: The ways in which I obscure imagery is trying to get to a kind of discussion about the ways in which we are all kind of abstract it well, like that there we go.
- [00:23:21.960]Noel Anderson: And that abstraction follows us here oh there we go i'm catching the rhythm now you boy you boy yes okay so, then I was lucky enough.
- [00:23:30.960]Noel Anderson: To get the exhibition at the contemporary art Center in Cincinnati was then travel to the hundred museum of American art and chattanooga appreciate everybody worked on those shows and them and the book, I never i've never been treated so nicely, in a sense.
- [00:23:47.920]Noel Anderson: which I really appreciate it and I found this image in a in a my sleuthing of archives, at one time in the FBI files and now it's kind of public domain, I see i'm.
- [00:23:59.040]Noel Anderson: of an event that occurred in Philadelphia in the early 70s right with rousseau's regime right you look at Russa look up russo's regime.
- [00:24:07.960]Noel Anderson: Terrible person where police would terrorize black communities, and you know they didn't invent this affiliate they were doing this in California and the 16th.
- [00:24:17.000]Noel Anderson: terrorize black communities and drag black men out of homes and stripped him naked now, the idea is that you know you can humiliate them and, while also abusing them, you know.
- [00:24:30.720]Noel Anderson: But I find a parallel in his image and multiple ways one I was the first image, where I was really allowed to think or I gave myself the liberty right, because as artists, we have to give ourselves liberty.
- [00:24:41.360]Noel Anderson: It was the first thing was I gave myself liberty to really deal with warping the image before I sent it to the weavers.
- [00:24:47.240]Noel Anderson: Right, because I was trying to get it to align to TV culture right because you know I remember standing in the corner of that kitchen when I was a born in the 80s.
- [00:24:56.560]Noel Anderson: Holding those antennas to that TV trying to stabilize that image and that image just didn't want to be stable and I realized.
- [00:25:02.680]Noel Anderson: I was God, I can stabilize the image, if I wanted to but chose not to, and that also fed into the way I realize it's really you know the black representations relationship to weaving.
- [00:25:13.120]Noel Anderson: So you know this kind of distorted image is particular to how i'm understanding the images that I receive about myself through that screen.
- [00:25:21.400]Noel Anderson: You know this form of abstraction whether it's the bending or warping of the image or it's the reducing of these black men to two suspects, all of these forms of abstraction to me and extraction.
- [00:25:36.160]Noel Anderson: are key and understanding how black masculinity is constructed in this world right.
- [00:25:46.560]Noel Anderson: Right and, but we also can talk about the scale of the image it aligns itself with the kind of history painting think about you know Washington crossing the Delaware Washington crossing the Delaware.
- [00:25:58.240]Noel Anderson: Right.
- [00:26:00.640]Noel Anderson: Or the history painting, of a kind of boy yeah which structurally my man Devon put me on it is I didn't even see it.
- [00:26:06.400]Noel Anderson: One of my old students and dear friends he's a family member of mine Devon after put me on to this, he was like yo we were standing in front of the tapestry at the CAC.
- [00:26:15.120]Noel Anderson: In Cincinnati he was like that's that that's that that's that Goya and I was like what he was like you know the may painting, I was like oh and structurally, yes, yes, structurally it's the same thing right.
- [00:26:31.840]Noel Anderson: But structurally it changes in a sense that I appreciated the fact that, when the legs been it turns it into some kind of seder or, goat and it really tries to get to.
- [00:26:41.920]Noel Anderson: An expression about the the kind of animosity of this kind of extraction right there's neck and neck or political structure right.
- [00:26:51.640]Noel Anderson: Now we're going to come to the home home home stretch when it comes to images and images that relate to the definition or the construction of black masculinity or misconstruction i'm also interested in appropriating from other people, and not just.
- [00:27:10.840]Noel Anderson: photo journalism or open sources right and and also isolating particular moments of black bodies fragmenting them right.
- [00:27:19.840]Noel Anderson: That that also identify them as a kind of sign so and it develops these kinds of this this cropping methods develops an icon that the black raise hand is the icon hands up right, it also creates a focus.
- [00:27:35.160]Noel Anderson: And in a weird way in a contradictory way it creates a kind of fragmented fetish.
- [00:27:40.560]Noel Anderson: Right there's a kind of fetish sizing and all the work that I have to understand that I am complicit in right when I put an image of half naked, if not fully naked black men are we've that.
- [00:27:52.000]Noel Anderson: And then present that I have I to have to understand at stake is I am producing in the world, conditions for the fetishization of my own subjectivity.
- [00:28:04.600]Noel Anderson: I will say that one more time when I put black men and weaving is like that I have to understand that I am to aiding I will say I probably aiding.
- [00:28:13.600]Noel Anderson: In the fetishization of the subjugation of black black men and black people's I understand that, but I will say this, I do I do this work because i'm trying to grapple with what the world is doing to us.
- [00:28:26.800]Noel Anderson: And i'm trying to catch that.
- [00:28:29.880]Noel Anderson: In weaving because I think weaving is a beautiful material.
- [00:28:34.000]Noel Anderson: But it also speaks to the speech truth to the power that the weaving.
- [00:28:38.320]Noel Anderson: are really about right, because if you think, historically, the only people who could really own this kind of weaving or a specific kind of.
- [00:28:46.720]Noel Anderson: Ever Socratic class so that there's a whole kind of class conversation that i'm trying to engage in these words right, so if we look at this one right.
- [00:28:55.000]Noel Anderson: The appropriation happens here with the doggone sculpture, that is, at the met and.
- [00:29:00.280]Noel Anderson: they've said they've sent to remove it, but I remember when I started making these I would go to the met and just stare that object, and it was just.
- [00:29:07.640]Noel Anderson: It just did everything for me is this 19th century raised raised hand wouldn't sculpture did everything also i've been appropriated Glenn lagan.
- [00:29:17.440]Noel Anderson: Right of praise hands of inappropriate image of Martin Luther King with a raise hand and then I take an image right within my own lexicon right let's let's go back a little bit I take an image from my own lexicon.
- [00:29:30.880]Noel Anderson: and reiterated again right so in a show all of these things are hanging together, you could be in front of this one quadrant right and then go to another room and find it it having a conference a different kind of conversation in a whole nother kind of space right.
- [00:29:46.240]Noel Anderson: And i'm i'm curious when I look at the image not particularly not just about its meaning in terms of what does it mean for the black hand to be raised, but i'm interested in what we talked about in you know art school one on one.
- [00:30:03.200]Noel Anderson: form and and concept, or something right, so what happens to the image let's just say this image here, Martin Luther King with his hand raise when it encounters a hand she made a sheet of handmade paper and warped.
- [00:30:18.880]Noel Anderson: What happens to the meaning when the thing gets iterated through another a whole nother filtration system, you get clean water, you get dirty water you get clean water which filtration do you want man coming to think of it which vaccine shot you're supposed to get you feel me hmm.
- [00:30:35.880]Noel Anderson: So the way we may these was I was doing a residency at dude on a paper making shout out to amy Jacobs and Tatiana the family.
- [00:30:46.320]Noel Anderson: I showed up with this idea that didn't know if it was going to work they didn't either no one had really done it before.
- [00:30:51.720]Noel Anderson: They said, what do you want to do, I said I have all these images from these textiles i've have told them, I want to make them into screens, which I can easily do it in my you right.
- [00:31:01.120]Noel Anderson: I cut them off this I cut I made like 20 screens of all these images from all these tapestries I had and I cut all the screens off roll them up.
- [00:31:08.920]Noel Anderson: And then you know booked booked it over to brooklyn Manhattan.
- [00:31:12.360]Noel Anderson: that's the hustle Israel hopped on the train, you know someone asked me, the other day, why didn't you just carry all the screens, I was like you want you're trying to carry 20 screens now brought on work that way.
- [00:31:20.680]Noel Anderson: So I cut them off roll them up and took them over there, we will then take a.
- [00:31:25.840]Noel Anderson: i'm going to speak like people know about paper we within huge or lay a wet sheet of light Blue Paper down.
- [00:31:33.880]Noel Anderson: A wet light blue fibers and then we would take one of the screens and we would roll it on top, and then we would take a bucket of dark Blue Paper pigment and we would massage it through the screen.
- [00:31:44.120]Noel Anderson: Right, the idea right is such that you're not printing on top of paper, the image is the paper.
- [00:31:53.280]Noel Anderson: The image is the ground that is absolute it is key in my work and we'll get there right, the fact that the image is the ground and not printed on the surface is important.
- [00:32:03.960]Noel Anderson: Because if the image is the ground, it is the thing that constitutes your very being, and that is the question I have with images, right now, and that is that is the.
- [00:32:12.280]Noel Anderson: That is like the history of the questions we've had with the accuracy of images, the problems with representation, you know reality versus appearance.
- [00:32:20.560]Noel Anderson: If I define myself off of an image that comes off of the screen that i've already established is not real and fake we can look at ITO stare and she talks about how the image has the screen okay.
- [00:32:31.040]Noel Anderson: If I already defined myself over an image that's not even realize that that doesn't define why it doesn't define the limits of the contract, who I am.
- [00:32:38.800]Noel Anderson: Then that ground i'm on is faulty and we are all faulty ground don't play yourself and i'm trying to make work that also engages that faulty ground by embedding the image in the ground itself right, and the same thing happens, we have the doggone sculpture here.
- [00:32:55.320]Noel Anderson: i'm almost there no the same thing happens when we're thinking about, and you know slow your eyes a little bit i'm gonna go back up real fast.
- [00:33:03.200]Noel Anderson: Right, the same thing happens when we're thinking about the tech textile work right, because these are all woven they're not printed on fabric they're woven.
- [00:33:11.800]Noel Anderson: And, if any, any thread gets picked or disabled or pulled out the whole image changes right, the reason I realized I liked weaving was not just because it's it's a kind of expression of of of information of computers of screen cultural data of photography of painting.
- [00:33:33.120]Noel Anderson: but also because it allows the image to be the ground, it allows the image to be the the con the kind of the foundation upon which I hope to build a whole nother way of seeing the world.
- [00:33:46.400]Noel Anderson: And i'm thinking that that way of seeing is is has everything to do with.
- [00:33:53.720]Noel Anderson: All territory and distance an intimacy ooh and trust let's go there intimacy and trust okay.
- [00:34:03.760]Noel Anderson: Okay, no okay now let's go there, because we got it was so it was let's say we get five minutes 510 minutes yeah there we go.
- [00:34:11.800]Noel Anderson: So, while I do donate.
- [00:34:14.320]Noel Anderson: They allowed me to expand and explore a little bit more, which I definitely appreciate it.
- [00:34:19.280]Noel Anderson: um I have this tapestry woven of a basketball player going up for a slam dunk it was spud webb I think in the what is it like 8688 slam dunk contest or something, and it was for this show of tapestries I did.
- [00:34:34.000]Noel Anderson: Excuse me, at my dealer friend zoom boost to it and Luxembourg i'll be actually doing a solo show there in October called shadow and act whoo that's gonna be fun, we can talk about that.
- [00:34:48.600]Noel Anderson: I have this tapestry woven and the image itself was work before I hand it over so you can see right.
- [00:34:56.440]Noel Anderson: there's a leg there's a leg and there's the foot there's a there's a portion of a leg in the backside of a foot and I walked it so that it slithered like a snake right, much like I was doing with dilating, which is the large black and white tapestry.
- [00:35:14.520]Noel Anderson: So I walked in and the idea was trying to replicate it the way we did before the other blue papers i'm using screen.
- [00:35:25.120]Noel Anderson: So I took the tapestry scanned it into the computer and separated all the threads to their own layers and then made their own screens I showed up to the lab with.
- [00:35:35.080]Noel Anderson: While the color counter here is 1234567 screens, I think it was like 13 we just kind of lost count.
- [00:35:43.440]Noel Anderson: I showed what 13 screens and we tried to lay layer it and we layered it pretty pretty solidly to try to replicate a tapestry as a print.
- [00:35:51.560]Noel Anderson: And what that allowed us to do is also touch right touch what George Surat the brilliant perceptual painter George Surat when he says in his notebooks you know I paint these dots.
- [00:36:09.040]Noel Anderson: Because i've seen cards weaving.
- [00:36:11.920]Noel Anderson: Right, so he was essentially trying to translate in a way those kinds of weaving so I thought to myself, how can we have why can't we go in reverse why can't we reach translate the weaving in another way right.
- [00:36:23.320]Noel Anderson: And I think in this way, it helps right, I think it really worked for me at least and understanding that you know excuse my movement, this can go from this to this, you know, to move this now how the hell, we gonna get there.
- [00:36:42.320]Noel Anderson: Well, how the hell, we gonna get ah, you must make yourself available.
- [00:36:47.600]Noel Anderson: Okay, I have a few more slides Perry if that's okay.
- [00:36:51.440]Perry Obee: It was making absolutely.
- [00:36:54.040]Noel Anderson: So.
- [00:36:55.680]Noel Anderson: Sam gilliam homeboy from louisville Kentucky.
- [00:37:00.280]Noel Anderson: i'll say a few things about that now, so the show that housing Lynn curated promise witness remembrance for briana Taylor at the speed museum alou was just open today.
- [00:37:15.400]Noel Anderson: She she did me the honor during install of installing five of my erased every new works next to Sam gilliam between Sam gilliam and lorna Simpson i'm like come on now.
- [00:37:27.840]Noel Anderson: You know I bow at the at the feet of giants, so I really appreciate that.
- [00:37:33.480]Noel Anderson: But then I was telling I was like you don't even know what you just did she said what you're talking about I said man.
- [00:37:37.600]Noel Anderson: Did you just see the show I didn't Uta she was like what I was like yeah I can Kelly matt additional Uta man and I finally got.
- [00:37:45.120]Noel Anderson: got to this level of abstraction I start i'm not knocking that's not true, no you gotta be honest with yourself that's good that's what they say.
- [00:37:51.840]Noel Anderson: I finally started to move towards this method of abstraction we'll get there.
- [00:37:58.000]Noel Anderson: I like this image, because I like I like I like Sam because the work drapes and it and it deals with weight and it deals with bodies.
- [00:38:06.720]Noel Anderson: And when you walk by a breathes and responds to you right and it's it's it's a kind of intimacy with color and form and space.
- [00:38:17.800]Noel Anderson: And that that's you know created by scale that makes you feel kind of good I think there's a pleasure in approaching these images and and there's there's a.
- [00:38:28.240]Noel Anderson: there's a confidence and guts that he had to have to make this move particular at a time when black abstract art abstraction by black artists was just not not.
- [00:38:39.080]Noel Anderson: Not popular how about that I don't think so, I remember this, I catalog this and I think Okay, maybe this is the way towards that that kind of.
- [00:38:49.280]Noel Anderson: abstraction that i'm talking about that occurs, both politically and.
- [00:38:54.760]Noel Anderson: Historically, in terms of art movements.
- [00:38:57.960]Noel Anderson: So I get here.
- [00:39:00.160]Noel Anderson: I do a tapestry, that if we do it by feet, this is what dreams one.
- [00:39:06.160]Noel Anderson: it's.
- [00:39:07.600]Noel Anderson: 20 by 2020 feet by 20 feet yeah and it just came down at Uta at a show that was curated by essence hard and how you know shout out to her, she.
- [00:39:18.680]Noel Anderson: she believed in the work I appreciate her for showing this, and this is an image and then let's go back the exhibition was about this kind of like.
- [00:39:26.000]Noel Anderson: Reminiscing or thinking it thinking about how structures of power have worked, since the La revolution right 1992 as well we call it, not the riot.
- [00:39:36.240]Noel Anderson: And I found these images that were really kind of jarring to me about the ways in which the the the police or we'll just call them the agents of power.
- [00:39:47.560]Noel Anderson: forcefully or use coercion to.
- [00:39:51.240]Noel Anderson: control the situation and, in that kind of irrational move towards coercion.
- [00:40:00.160]Noel Anderson: It reduced out or it abstracted black femininity.
- [00:40:04.800]Noel Anderson: let's go there.
- [00:40:07.000]Noel Anderson: When you look at the image what you're seeing and i'm going to zoom in.
- [00:40:11.400]Noel Anderson: you're seeing a an African American woman in terror and fear, with their head pressed against a cop car.
- [00:40:18.920]Noel Anderson: You see another male here and what's what's go back what's kind of scrunched up in here which you cannot find right.
- [00:40:25.480]Noel Anderson: is another male another black male African American male being pressed against the COP car as well right so she is bracketed.
- [00:40:31.720]Noel Anderson: Within these two black men and at no time is she recognized for the woman that she is the Queen and she is she has been reduced or or, as I think every store and would call it she's been engendered right there's a way in which power structures, reduce out all of that and and and I think.
- [00:40:50.120]Noel Anderson: I think that that those are kind of the critiques that we can have when it comes to like.
- [00:40:55.840]Noel Anderson: Well, I don't wanna I don't want let's go there no I think that's some of the critiques that we can have when it comes to.
- [00:41:05.080]Noel Anderson: treatment from the police right when it comes to treatment from the police, but I, like the image, even though it's a charge and tough image to to encounter.
- [00:41:16.280]Noel Anderson: I like the image one because it's very haunting and I try to echo that haunting by the drape I also appreciate the image, because it doubles down on the.
- [00:41:25.280]Noel Anderson: The kind of limits of visually or the limits of visibility, or the limits of vision that the structure will give you so I I fall back on that right, instead of saying, instead of saying.
- [00:41:35.920]Noel Anderson: You all you know the structure doesn't see me for who I am the structure has a limit to its vision or me it's already abstracted me as if i'm a blur from 5000 miles away.
- [00:41:44.800]Noel Anderson: I say this is the image, I give you but i'm going to abstracted for you, I reduced the access that you will not give me right, so I by folding the image on itself or draping it it fold it in obstructed view.
- [00:41:58.440]Noel Anderson: And I appreciate that because I think that's what it's about visit there's a necessary there's a necessary obstruction of access that that the viewer needs to.
- [00:42:08.800]Noel Anderson: contend with in my work because I just don't think that all of the all of the material needs to be made available, you need to do a little work right, we need to do a little work, we need to require our viewers to do a little bit more work okay okay cool cool cool cool cool.
- [00:42:23.840]Noel Anderson: And that brings us to the last couple slides I said, slides like i'm that old That brings us to the last couple of images.
- [00:42:30.560]Noel Anderson: So i've been working on this idea, and I mean i've been doing it for a few years but haven't shown anybody, and I just recently that i've started putting it on ice, you know i'm really sensitive about my craft a little nervous but i'm learning to lean in and trust.
- [00:42:44.680]Noel Anderson: So I stumbled across you know.
- [00:42:47.880]Noel Anderson: As artists mark toby i've known mark toby's work for quite a while, because we learned it in you know survey our history 1945 to the President modernism whatever.
- [00:42:57.880]Noel Anderson: And I did, but I didn't I didn't make much sense of this thing he called right writing, only to find out oh OK, so this guy mark toby.
- [00:43:05.800]Noel Anderson: Who influences john cage's you know interesting to eastern philosophy, by going all the way to the East to find this kind of calligraphic writing this calligraphic method from from China, Japan Islam right he goes to.
- [00:43:18.760]Noel Anderson: All territory, he goes to the horizon of difference, he goes to the edge right he gets to the proximity and the presence, he gets to the face of the people who made this work collects it and then goes home.
- [00:43:34.360]Noel Anderson: I don't know if that's a colonizer but it's something he comes back here to raise this kind of thing he calls white writing right.
- [00:43:41.440]Noel Anderson: He and white writing what you're really seeing is there's like a field of like there's a field of color are muted color underneath all of these kinds of situations in this scaffolding of white marks.
- [00:43:51.360]Noel Anderson: I thought to myself if that's not if that's not colonialism, what the Fuck is i'm going to take it i'm going to use it and i'm going to call it black writing.
- [00:43:59.680]Noel Anderson: And that black writing is going to be the distinction between abstraction and figuration and that black writing is going to encounter images that.
- [00:44:09.080]Noel Anderson: Politically, are about the abstraction of the reduction of black people's or specifically black men and women black people, but in a different kind of woven way so let's go here.
- [00:44:19.320]Noel Anderson: is another image for Philadelphia and he's 64 so you know the chokehold being used forever let's let's be honest right came from slavery right there we go even before and i'm taking this image and i'm going here right, so what i've done let's go back real quick, this is your image.
- [00:44:40.360]Noel Anderson: This is it won't once this is inverted woven again on itself it's card it's called a horror shack was like a horror right or a rush act, meaning the two images are flipped on top of themselves are mirroring.
- [00:44:52.440]Noel Anderson: If you look closely i'm doing this method so it's bleaching die mentally laser cut basketball leather on distress stretch tapestry right, but if we get closer i'm doing.
- [00:45:04.040]Noel Anderson: What I believe.
- [00:45:06.600]Noel Anderson: toby is doing, I am actually going into the tapestry and picking the threads by hand.
- [00:45:11.440]Noel Anderson: So I take a nail or an all or some kind of needle I go in and I pull those threads out to to shake the very ground of that image right So when I said before, I we I will I leave the image, so that it's warped because I realized that the image itself wasn't real right.
- [00:45:28.640]Noel Anderson: But it was used as a ground to define me.
- [00:45:31.720]Noel Anderson: i'm also shaking the ground by picking the threats right and we could think of it on an even more conceptual level, this is black writing as this is is white writing.
- [00:45:39.760]Noel Anderson: it's black writing now, not just because i'm using i'm laser cutting basketball material which is the kind of color and feeling of black skin, what does it mean to make the black body.
- [00:45:48.880]Noel Anderson: Right, we can talk about Fred mcnair what does it mean to make the black body shriek.
- [00:45:53.240]Noel Anderson: Right i'm not only talking about black writing in this laser cut this laser cutter thing i've invented.
- [00:45:58.200]Noel Anderson: I am talking about black writing in the way I pick this thread, the fact that this thread is cotton, the fact that black people pick cotton, I am talking about the way black people historically have to find themselves through Labor.
- [00:46:10.800]Noel Anderson: that's what i'm talking about.
- [00:46:12.960]Noel Anderson: And all of that requires us to understand that the hedge of mine is structure that defines me and defines you keeps you at a distance.
- [00:46:22.200]Noel Anderson: And when I say it keeps you at a distance it extracts you think of it that way to keep you at a distance means you are blurry that is an abstraction if it had if it if it didn't keep you at a distance, it would have to deal with you.
- [00:46:36.880]Noel Anderson: Right and we've we far past we've surpassed that, let me deal with you in a polite way in a political way right.
- [00:46:43.720]Noel Anderson: So let's let's really sit with what i'm talking about right now that we're not i'm not just talking about like yeah making abstract paintings nah man.
- [00:46:50.160]Noel Anderson: i'm talking about a whole network of political structure that is doing what I think these tabs are trying to do to you every single day.
- [00:46:59.400]Noel Anderson: And i'm just trying to do it in a way that's soft sometimes funny sometimes tough but like good therapy like like like a.
- [00:47:08.560]Noel Anderson: what's his name bb King says, like a good limit is good for what ails you is good for whatever ails you if you come to my work and you make yourself available.
- [00:47:17.840]Noel Anderson: I promise you, whatever comes back it might hurt for a while, but if you sit with him deal with it it'll heal you I really do believe that and.
- [00:47:28.680]Noel Anderson: Let me see I think not going to show that I think that's it.
- [00:47:32.800]Noel Anderson: cool cool cool cool cool stop my share.
- [00:47:37.040]Noel Anderson: Was that okay.
- [00:47:38.600]Perry Obee: yeah that was great.
- [00:47:39.840]Noel Anderson: Thank you for shows and house was a family seen you in years.
- [00:47:44.040]Perry Obee: wow well, I mean yeah Thank you so much, and all you make 1000 connections, a minute, you know I my mind, is just just wrapping around.
- [00:47:53.240]Noel Anderson: All of the we have recording Sir that's why we have recordings.
- [00:47:56.440]Perry Obee: Exactly yeah no it's just it's always so amazing and lightning every time I hear you talk about your work again just yeah those connections that that you make are just brilliant i'm still thinking about them.
- [00:48:11.080]Perry Obee: I would love to know if there's any questions you can throw them in the chat.
- [00:48:15.760]Noel Anderson: Actually, can I say I told my my dealers I would do this.
- [00:48:19.400]Noel Anderson: And then you just made a couple of announcements.
- [00:48:21.960]Perry Obee: yeah make make them.
- [00:48:23.320]Noel Anderson: All right, so yeah so a couple shows promise witness remember it's just opened at the speed museum curated by aws and Glenn yo it just got the other times, right up not happy about that, but that's okay.
- [00:48:36.520]Noel Anderson: Then I have a solo show that's open now, I have a solo show opening in the beginning of March, with the new tapestries the last the last tapestry us all wars hora shack that's one of them, another one is a.
- [00:48:48.880]Noel Anderson: 10 foot by eight foot tapestry of the arrest of a black men in the reflection of a police car, but its flipped upside down so you're watching.
- [00:48:57.240]Noel Anderson: The arrest be abstracted by the reflection of the car goddamn gorgeous that goddamn gorgeous and is died, who is beautiful.
- [00:49:04.600]Noel Anderson: That opens at a Gal that the show is called reflection of a black cat bone it opens at jd J ice house and garrison New York what's up Jane how Adam she has a great show up right now soon veal.
- [00:49:16.200]Noel Anderson: Ex partner rauschenberg susan's a beast would it would those books, a couple more things sorry solo show shadow and act opening and Luxembourg and october's don't bullshit.
- [00:49:25.200]Noel Anderson: I also have solo show heavy is the Crown and other museum show at the telfair museum of art in savannah and then i'm doing a couple of talks i'm doing a talk on Monday at real art ways, you can go on real art radio.org we're going to talk about what does it mean.
- [00:49:37.320]Noel Anderson: to shout out.
- [00:49:38.200]Noel Anderson: rust and be vulnerable, what does it mean for black men to trust and be vulnerable because we got to learn how to love and Mike Tyson is one of the examples of why we're afraid it's very bizarre.
- [00:49:49.320]Noel Anderson: And in June i'm doing a talk for the speed.
- [00:49:53.400]Noel Anderson: But i'll post that on rg and then i'll also post the I think i'm doing a panel at freeze New York, this may with essence and a few other really brilliant ours, but i'll post all that ID so you know follow me it if you don't know how I did boy so let's get some questions let's.
- [00:50:09.400]Perry Obee: Get we get we get a lot of questions coming in.
- [00:50:13.360]Perry Obee: First up well it's a question in the chat have you written any books.
- [00:50:18.080]Noel Anderson: i've written a couple essays did you go to my website, you can see the essay I wrote about David hammons and using George bow ties.
- [00:50:28.760]Noel Anderson: shoot where Am I expenditure there we go using George but time based materialism and expenditure and Marxism as a way to critique and understand David hammons.
- [00:50:40.240]Noel Anderson: Class critique of black black class i've written that.
- [00:50:44.840]Noel Anderson: I wrote an essay for the show that my friends in right now real art ways it's a short like two pager but it I think it's fucking bad ass.
- [00:50:53.000]Noel Anderson: And then i'm working on an essay right now about the I don't have a title for it, yet it goes to the editors in June, but the premise is something like.
- [00:51:04.400]Noel Anderson: After watching George florid be assassinated, how is a black teacher supposed to go back into the university and teach white kids and what i'm going to try to do is look at the the use of.
- [00:51:18.040]Noel Anderson: Men bay's niekro political essays as well as food goes bio power and relate that to a barrage entanglements.
- [00:51:29.240]Noel Anderson: And and try to read that through the Roman understanding of the pen a guy goes, which is like the early slave teacher there's a whole thing i'm trying to work through there.
- [00:51:37.360]Noel Anderson: i'm gonna try i've been trying for like two months breaking my hip i'm gonna get it so that's what I have coming up, you know nice, but if you know of any people who wants someone to write i'm always down to write more shit yeah.
- [00:51:48.400]Perry Obee: Right your writings are available, like on your website.
- [00:51:51.480]Noel Anderson: yeah just go to the way search.
- [00:51:52.800]yeah.
- [00:51:54.760]Perry Obee: um let's see another question Could you elaborate on the eraser of black women's gender and anti black policing.
- [00:52:01.880]Noel Anderson: Yes, okay that's good so there's this like myth right there was this myth that when I was growing up, because the images were always.
- [00:52:10.480]Noel Anderson: Informing this men are supporting these men at the only people who were lynched in though that fucking terror that was a white government ality if I, if I can call it that.
- [00:52:22.000]Noel Anderson: that the only people who are looking for black men na na na na na na black women were stripped of the the nomenclature of the title human way before black men were and they were lynched to right right I can't I can't look.
- [00:52:39.520]Noel Anderson: I can't look at.
- [00:52:41.640]Noel Anderson: The way on which you know some of our sisters have been taken out.
- [00:52:46.840]Noel Anderson: violently and think that that form of eraser.
- [00:52:52.840]Noel Anderson: didn't reduce out.
- [00:52:55.600]Noel Anderson: white men understanding them as women let's let's be real right because white pedigree white white patriarchy is really King on.
- [00:53:05.440]Noel Anderson: Using white women hood right right women as the means for controlling the world.
- [00:53:13.080]Noel Anderson: it's just what it is right, so they see, they can see gender they wouldn't i'm sorry I hate, I have to say with my understanding of of modernism modern move I just don't think that.
- [00:53:29.080]Noel Anderson: White women are as engendered or D gendered you can read norton's book on that black on both sides, I don't think white women have been nearly as engendered but I don't think billy's are going to engender white women as well black that's just my thought.
- [00:53:45.520]Noel Anderson: Because even it's norton's book he made it make a great argument about how.
- [00:53:50.880]Noel Anderson: How we look at.
- [00:53:55.280]Noel Anderson: The history of medicine, specifically in the 19th century, how slaves were taken right, you will get those guys the photographs that at Harvard is battling over something.
- [00:54:04.720]Noel Anderson: The way slaves were taken, and then used, as you know, tools or non feeling human beings and experiments right we can't look at a women's health care and I realized black women were destroyed to have to make it happen.
- [00:54:23.400]Noel Anderson: Right so there's I have to believe that the white man would not you know white people would not do white men would not do that, to their mothers, I would hope, so I you know so that's how i'm thinking about it.
- [00:54:35.720]Noel Anderson: Thank you yeah and I think that in that way, I think that's the kind of Iranian entanglement I think that any works can get into, and when I say burrata and entanglement i'm talking about.
- [00:54:46.760]Noel Anderson: This this, this was a shambo Rod, who says, who uses this this term quantum physics and quantum physics, which is entanglement which is is a moment when two things are indecipherable.
- [00:55:00.320]Noel Anderson: Right, so I think there's a way in which I can look at those arrays 70 pages and the thing for me that's indecipherable in some moments is well is the eraser a positive, or is it a negative you feel me.
- [00:55:14.440]Noel Anderson: yeah so that's that's how I would think here.
- [00:55:20.560]Perry Obee: here's a good question for you know was art something you've always been interested in or did that interest develop over time.
- [00:55:29.160]Noel Anderson: Oh, I you know my my father, one of my best friends.
- [00:55:34.800]Noel Anderson: He would he was a civil engineer, and when I was a boy, he would leave alone station wagon he would load the station wagon up during the summers he would drive you to is.
- [00:55:43.840]Noel Anderson: The sites where he was working now those sites happened to be government housing, so you know he he had his own firm and the government would hire him to fix the projects let's be real.
- [00:55:53.920]Noel Anderson: Because he would go in there and be like the government don't give a Fuck about these people i'm here to fix it.
- [00:55:57.680]Noel Anderson: But the point is on those rides those to our car rides and that station wagon we had to have something to do so, he would buy learn how to draw.
- [00:56:06.480]Noel Anderson: comic characters you know you would try to give you a sheet of tracing paper and a piece of carbon paper, and I would be in a world for two hours.
- [00:56:15.040]Noel Anderson: And I knew then that this was it I knew that if I could, if I could trace fred's flintstones head and super imposing on.
- [00:56:21.600]Noel Anderson: On you know snoop his foot, I was like shit what world is it you know world is this possible, I like this reality that's kind of like falling through the looking glass if i'm Alice you did.
- [00:56:34.080]yeah.
- [00:56:35.800]Perry Obee: yeah I get it so it's always it's it's always been there, but it's also developed over time i'm sure.
- [00:56:41.600]Noel Anderson: yeah, but I think the things that I mean honestly, how would I, how can I like wow, but I think recently, and this is gonna.
- [00:56:51.320]Noel Anderson: I said this talk I did a couple weeks ago and i'll say it again, because I advocate for it for everybody, but particularly for men of color I think my my final acceptance of what therapy does for you.
- [00:57:05.600]Noel Anderson: Right, this is for artists, because i'm tell you right now on university campus we are the ones who we fund the therapy departments right we do the Grad students, I have.
- [00:57:14.440]Noel Anderson: And when I was in Grad school, we were the ones were there all the time and and learning reason you know, in the past year because of you know coven and going back to therapy like.
- [00:57:23.080]Noel Anderson: Making myself open to the world right and learning how to love and i'll take matt tell you an anecdote real quick if you don't mind yeah Okay, because I told us a week or a couple weeks ago and I tell stories over and over again, but i'm sorry so i'm.
- [00:57:39.400]Noel Anderson: A few a few a few weeks ago my my partner and I we went to the met on a Sunday afternoon, you did um yeah no, I was in a particular kind of my state i'm gonna be honest.
- [00:57:51.120]Noel Anderson: which was a good mindset, to be in on a Sunday afternoon in New York, when you encode it, but you know at this time, the metropolitan museum of art is empty it's great so i'm just walking around the the African wing.
- [00:58:03.040]Noel Anderson: For like an hour, so I give about our i'm good I think a little stroll right and I realized, I spent 45 minutes photographing the shadows on the floor.
- [00:58:12.280]Noel Anderson: That was being projected from the harsh lighting in the African wing from the from the sculptures to the floor right and the reflection, I did that for fucking out for like 45 minutes right, and then I remember coming home and realize why I was able to do it.
- [00:58:26.600]Noel Anderson: Is because I was with the person I love.
- [00:58:29.800]Noel Anderson: And the person I love made my mind, open and available to everything I was able to trust them and trust that space.
- [00:58:38.240]Noel Anderson: Right I wish I would have been able to do that earlier and I think my work would have grown a lot faster, you know I might have been somewhere differently, but that I do advocate that that is a huge part of the growth.
- [00:58:49.520]Noel Anderson: And then allowed me to, as I think Hannah and I were talking about it allowed me to find things in the world.
- [00:58:58.960]Noel Anderson: It allowed me to find value and things of the world that other people were telling me had no value.
- [00:59:03.720]Noel Anderson: You feel me and that's the same thing i'm doing when i'm talking about there's a particular kind of way that.
- [00:59:10.000]Noel Anderson: The European or the hegemonic structure we could call it alberti have we talked about 15th century painting it's to kind of way that structure tries to qualify you with a call a grid thinking right.
- [00:59:22.120]Noel Anderson: And I just think that a lot of us in the art world or a lot of us in general don't fit that grid.
- [00:59:28.920]Noel Anderson: And the thing that the grid.
- [00:59:31.400]Noel Anderson: requires of you, the few things the grid requires you to recognize or to think that vulnerability is a sin.
- [00:59:40.840]Noel Anderson: Right to be vulnerable is a problem with the Fuck it, is it not a problem at all, no damn problem, it also requires you to not see the value and other things that are really valuable.
- [00:59:52.120]Noel Anderson: That also means your history right.
- [00:59:54.880]Noel Anderson: It had had I stuck within this grid of thinking and then i'll stop I wouldn't have recognized that you know Dave the potter was a genius by putting a letter putting language on the inside of his pot.
- [01:00:05.320]Noel Anderson: You know where words were not allowed to go right like people were not allowed to have language in the in the 19th century, when we were slaves right.
- [01:00:12.400]Noel Anderson: So we talked about the pot, then, is a representation of the black body, because the black body was where words not allowed to go well, let me interior eyes that put that inside me as well as put that in the pot you feel me.
- [01:00:24.800]yeah Thank you.
- [01:00:28.600]Noel Anderson: Any more questions we're tracking.
- [01:00:31.200]Perry Obee: is a good one here and to where we can watch some of your upcoming talks and also i'll add to that a plug here for for Tamar and.
- [01:00:42.080]Perry Obee: What you can talk about that talk, he did a couple weeks ago with Ashton T Crawley, that was a great conversation you had with i'm sure that can be found online too.
- [01:00:51.960]Noel Anderson: yeah you can find that on Tamar I mean vows here, it was a vow.
- [01:00:55.640]Noel Anderson: You can, I think that that's on the tamer website that was a good talk, we went somewhere i'm excited to work with that brother I wanna I want to write with him, I do like something we were we were we were in a whole nother space and.
- [01:01:07.400]Noel Anderson: It was like jazz have been I was like booty booty call kami kami kami monk.
- [01:01:12.880]Perry Obee: yeah I was there and and I encourage people to go find that that talk was really brilliant fascinating discussion, you had and some of the other ones, you had coming up or they can they be found online.
- [01:01:25.480]Noel Anderson: yeah so let's see the one on Monday, you can just go to real art waves are real art ways.org my man philanderers tim's his shows up the things that haunt me brilliant.
- [01:01:38.840]Noel Anderson: We when we go into some Mike Tyson you know I wrote an essay about it, and I was like you know I analyze the ring walk in the remark, if you all don't know.
- [01:01:47.280]Noel Anderson: Is when the Boxer goes from the dressing room to the ring and I grew up watching that in the 80s and 90s.
- [01:01:53.760]Noel Anderson: And it was always the pageantry was always mesmerizing because around that black body that one black body, who was going into face death was a whole slew of other black bodies who are cheering him on to his death right.
- [01:02:05.880]Noel Anderson: And, but, but all of that is framed by the loudspeaker that has to pocket cores.
- [01:02:13.040]Noel Anderson: ambitions of a writer pumping down right and then come to find out later, while listening to Mike Tyson talk about what he's feeling while he's doing that we walk he's like i'm afraid.
- [01:02:25.840]Noel Anderson: And i'm like what he's like i'm fucking afraid and i'm all i'm thinking there now whole walk is i'm gonna get you before you get me.
- [01:02:32.680]Noel Anderson: And then I realized all he's talking about is this shit he was talking about when he was a child right when he's talking about I got I got beat up.
- [01:02:40.720]Noel Anderson: My my parents put cigarettes out on me I didn't know where I was going to sleep, I was afraid.
- [01:02:46.720]Noel Anderson: And I spent my entire life fighting this world because I was afraid of being hurt and I knew at 13 I wasn't gonna let anybody hurt me any more than I had been heard already, that is what that is what black men are contending with right now.
- [01:03:01.120]Noel Anderson: right and it takes a lot of guts for black men to open themselves and be available to the world.
- [01:03:07.320]Noel Anderson: You feel them so go to go to a real art wave.org and join the conversation manga is Charlie practice, going beyond the homie and then i'm assuming the speed will will post it, but I also put this stuff I gee I know i'm terrible at it sorry.
- [01:03:22.400]Noel Anderson: You know, usually reading or something but i'll put it on y'all can see it for real yes, no follow me I need more followers yeah absolutely.
- [01:03:32.080]Perry Obee: And one more came in this might be a good one to end on i'm sure, a lot of people would like to hear more about you talking about why.
- [01:03:39.440]Perry Obee: What led you to go back to Grad school, you know, to get to get the MFA in printmaking and then to go to gail for the sculpture MFA what was what led you to do that.
- [01:03:53.320]Noel Anderson: Okay, let me just write something down I just thought about something.
- [01:03:58.200]Noel Anderson: This this conversation got me thinking of something I love the project shit.
- [01:04:03.040]Noel Anderson: Like 20 projects and my mom so so okay what led me to go back oh punishment man, I like, as I know.
- [01:04:10.360]Noel Anderson: When I was at indiana I remember the the woman, I was dating at the time, very lovely person, one of our costumes was from what was that from Pulp Fiction I had the ball gag you go figure i'm serious well, let me back i'm.
- [01:04:28.200]Noel Anderson: honestly.
- [01:04:30.640]Noel Anderson: I knew that there was a huge gap in my research and I didn't understand at the time that art was research.
- [01:04:38.080]Noel Anderson: And I knew I was comfortable and confident enough to to recognize, one of the biggest gaps, I had was theory.
- [01:04:46.240]Noel Anderson: Right and I was told when I was in Grad school indiana, and this was I shouldn't have listened was don't read that is too hard.
- [01:04:53.560]Noel Anderson: And I had I had internalized that fear for years and then, when I got to yeah.
- [01:04:59.440]Noel Anderson: It was no holds barred Oh, it was just fucking theory every every second was read this read that.
- [01:05:04.880]Noel Anderson: Now i'm not going to act like everybody else who the Fuck they was talking about, because they did not, I have come to learn that now, after reading the stuff myself with the people who wrote it i'm like oh that's what you were talking about my bad.
- [01:05:14.000]Noel Anderson: But still a gave me a kind of ground me to do the kind of thinking and the pace of the thinking that I do now, you know, to make those kinds of connections at this at this speed i'll.
- [01:05:25.200]Noel Anderson: You know I really needed it and honestly if if I didn't have that and I didn't have the you know the family that I have whether it's my in my my immediate family who I love to death.
- [01:05:36.080]Noel Anderson: or it's my my extended family was Dr Chris Holland, who also gives me this brilliant idea live don't have that book out here right now, Dr Chris Holland, he teaches that.
- [01:05:47.000]Noel Anderson: universe Cincinnati I have him and he was the one who helped me through all this stuff to you know and and.
- [01:05:55.040]Noel Anderson: I really do believe that that kind of like sitting with theory, or at least sitting with ideas and really just sitting with them and thinking about them, because I feel like the art world.
- [01:06:04.840]Noel Anderson: doesn't always give you that time to think really plan your idea, because I, you know it took me 10 years to figure this out about picking the tapestries and dying staining them.
- [01:06:17.720]Noel Anderson: Or maybe it took me four years to figure it out and it took me another six to have confidence to realize it.
- [01:06:23.920]Noel Anderson: i'm filming and now i'm just realizing all these other connections, specifically with what I want to be, I want to call that you know all charity or blackness at the edge of vision, I really do think that's what it is i'm finding.
- [01:06:35.480]Noel Anderson: i'm finding ways to talk about it and feminist criticism if i'm if it's like Patricia hill columns if it's Helen says Oh, she saw my writing the body, I read a lot of feminist theory and all that stuff like all of us at.
- [01:06:50.760]Noel Anderson: You know and it's also bringing that toxic masculinity like a son of a bitch.
- [01:06:56.080]Noel Anderson: But yeah man, I appreciate y'all having me, I hope I didn't you know ramble too much.
- [01:06:59.440]Perry Obee: No absolutely no this is.
- [01:07:00.480]Perry Obee: Good I mean if anyone has you know any other questions throw them in the chat now.
- [01:07:05.040]Noel Anderson: let's give them another minute.
- [01:07:06.040]Noel Anderson: Anyway, i'm answers you.
- [01:07:07.840]Perry Obee: yeah no I mean I just again, to thank you for sharing that with us, I mean I you know being vulnerable with us, you know and letting us into your world a little.
- [01:07:18.800]Noel Anderson: bit listen.
- [01:07:19.840]Perry Obee: dancing all of this down to just an hour i'm sure is not not easy, because there's clearly a lot a lot to think about in the work it's very thought provoking.
- [01:07:32.280]Noel Anderson: that's fair listen, let me just say man i'm done.
- [01:07:35.880]Noel Anderson: I realized a long time I go My job was to do is work my duty that's what they send me that's what the ancestors sent me here for what i'm dead and gone I want them to say I did mine.
- [01:07:45.080]Noel Anderson: I don't want to have to come back or if I don't have to I wanted to be like you leveled up homie you are hipaa lighter you are the motherboard yes black SCI fi is real.
- [01:07:55.960]Noel Anderson: So thank you for having me I really appreciate you all, you know if you if you, you can DM me it I it I answer I answer everything it just takes me a while, but I answer i'm always interested in ideas.
- [01:08:05.760]Noel Anderson: I got conversation going right now with a whole bunch of people from other talks, you know take two weeks, we talked about amazing stuff so if you're interested just hollered your boy okay yeah.
- [01:08:14.000]Perry Obee: Absolutely well thanks again for being so accessible and.
- [01:08:17.120]Perry Obee: Taking the time with my students it's been great we'll see you tomorrow follow up on them and yeah i'll keep the meeting open for another few minutes but um you know if anyone has any other questions, otherwise you know Thank you again, Noel. and a round of virtual Applause
- [01:08:35.680]Perry Obee: Thank you to.
- [01:08:36.800]Noel Anderson: Everyone who showed up and listen to me.
- [01:08:38.680]Perry Obee: yeah Thank you.
- [01:08:39.600]Noel Anderson: Thanks guys, I appreciate y'all absolutely.
- [01:08:42.400]Perry Obee: Well Thank you everyone good night.
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