Using Technology in Water & Nitrogen Management Question and Answer Session

University of Nebraska – Lincoln Author

08/31/2020 Added

4 Plays

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Question and Answer session with Dr. Kendall DeJonge, Dr. Brian Arnall and Jason Bode, Dr. Daran Rudnick, Moderator
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[00:00:09.220]Thank you Jason, so that concludes the presentations
[00:00:13.420]we have for this session, again if you have any questions
[00:00:17.820]or comments for the speakers, please put them in the chat.
[00:00:21.460]So kind of starting out, first I wanna thank you,
[00:00:24.980]Jason, Kendall and Brian for taking the time to interact
[00:00:27.680]with the growers here, on our first ever virtual field tour.
[00:00:33.850]So maybe kind of starting out,
[00:00:35.330]what recommendations would you guys have for some
[00:00:38.150]of the growers that might be new to precision equipment,
[00:00:41.290]whether that is on the water or fertility side?
[00:00:51.950]Why don't we start with you Brian?
[00:00:53.910]Oh, I was hoping Jason would go first,
[00:00:55.520]I really wanted him to take on that one.
[00:00:59.410]Oh, that's a tough one, Daran,
[00:01:02.350]for me I try to remind people when they're talking
[00:01:06.070]technology, there's no one size fits all.
[00:01:08.705]There's not gonna be a silver bullet that the tech
[00:01:13.230]has to fit the producer and the land equally,
[00:01:18.100]and so just because it works elsewhere,
[00:01:20.060]doesn't mean they'll work with you, and so approach it.
[00:01:22.047]And I was go back and it doesn't matter what technology
[00:01:24.810]and I wanna take this away from nitrogen.
[00:01:26.920]For me, I'm precision technologies.
[00:01:29.940]I want a producer to tell me what's our greatest concern
[00:01:32.560]or what's our one, goal to tackle one issue at a time,
[00:01:37.700]and I don't know Jason was say about this,
[00:01:39.270]but I don't think somebody should jump into both irrigation
[00:01:42.030]and nitrogen and something else at the same time,
[00:01:44.410]but kind of get one thing handled,
[00:01:48.010]get a handle on your water management irrigation management
[00:01:50.620]or your nitrogen management for moving on.
[00:01:52.970]And I think some people jump in a little bit too hard right
[00:01:56.780]away and can get overwhelmed with a bunch of technology.
[00:02:02.680]I'll I back that up, Brian, I mean,
[00:02:05.070]we made a ton of mistakes when first started out
[00:02:07.890]and my 2014, we tried to bite off the whole bullet at once
[00:02:12.640]of a variable rate seeding,
[00:02:16.606]a variable rate P and K and variable rate nitrogen,
[00:02:20.380]I guess where I would start is I would start
[00:02:24.890]with the variable rate plant populations first
[00:02:29.470]that one can have a lot of influence
[00:02:31.242]on water use as well as nitrogen use.
[00:02:35.580]And once you kind of get that part nailed and dialed in on,
[00:02:39.350]each field, then you can do a lot better
[00:02:41.250]with the other pieces of it.
[00:02:43.010]But if you've got either too few or too many plants,
[00:02:46.900]it's hard, to get the rest of it to come in, right as well.
[00:02:55.670]I would echo also what Brian said, trying to have focus
[00:03:00.560]schools and trying to prioritize what you really
[00:03:04.130]wanna do with the technology is pretty important.
[00:03:07.080]If you have too many things going on at once,
[00:03:08.680]it can be breaking, pounding,
[00:03:12.200]also just being patient with the technology.
[00:03:15.350]It takes some time to develop things,
[00:03:18.170]especially in field research and agriculture,
[00:03:20.300]we all want to prove things in the field
[00:03:22.200]and make sure that it happens in a real life setting,
[00:03:24.270]not just a greenhouse or a model or whatever,
[00:03:27.560]but that takes a lot of time to be able
[00:03:29.630]to do that with a lot of confidence,
[00:03:32.660]and so sometimes if you're an early adopter in technology,
[00:03:36.950]you might get to help work out the kinks, so to speak.
[00:03:40.880]So, if you can be patient with that too,
[00:03:44.000]and give good feedback to people developing
[00:03:46.570]that, it's a good feedback mechanism.
[00:03:49.300]We all learn more.
[00:03:53.110]Perfectly, thank you guys for that.
[00:03:55.150]So kind of thinking and building off of those comments.
[00:03:58.690]So as we work on some of the research sites,
[00:04:01.820]we have different methods and how we evaluate maybe
[00:04:05.360]successes of different applications or approaches,
[00:04:09.310]as a grower starts to adopt some of this precision
[00:04:11.670]technology, as you guys mentioned, maybe starting with one,
[00:04:15.170]how do you as a grower evaluate success
[00:04:18.900]and with all this opportunity out there,
[00:04:21.220]how do you go from one input and then to the second one
[00:04:24.540]and evaluate how those two and then maybe the third.
[00:04:28.470]So how do you work through that process?
[00:04:34.550]I'll start as a, a producer, that's gone through it.
[00:04:39.700]The high rate nitrogen strip has been a great way for us
[00:04:44.200]to test, hey, are we getting this right,
[00:04:46.060]are we getting this wrong?
[00:04:48.718]And if you take that over into water or plant populations,
[00:04:55.040]give yourself some, fixed checked areas that you're working
[00:04:58.190]against, knowing full well that you're gonna make mistakes,
[00:05:02.040]and, you're gonna get some of it wrong,
[00:05:04.440]and it's not gonna take you two or three years or even
[00:05:06.280]four years to really get the real results you want,
[00:05:09.970]but start on it, if you're not ready to do variable rate
[00:05:14.210]fertilizer, yet we'll just put in three
[00:05:16.880]or four solid rate blocks and know where they're at
[00:05:20.299]and keep track of those.
[00:05:21.132]And if you're not ready to do variable rate seeding yet
[00:05:24.440]just put in two or three or four long walks, big five,
[00:05:28.430]10 acre blocks and help help make some assessments there.
[00:05:32.040]And honestly you need to probably keep doing that and just
[00:05:34.850]keep, checking your process year over year.
[00:05:39.420]Can, I say hallelujah, Jason?
[00:05:42.940]That's that's absolutely the best answer
[00:05:47.900]that could be, and it's something that academia
[00:05:50.700]and extension should tell farmers more is that we should
[00:05:54.230]always have these check blocks out, always stop it.
[00:05:57.710]The technology now is so much easier than 15 years ago to do
[00:06:01.640]some of this stuff to put out different rates of,
[00:06:03.572]and it doesn't matter what we're all talking about.
[00:06:07.010]Precision technology site-specific management,
[00:06:10.350]that most of our sites specific management is using
[00:06:13.180]non site specific information.
[00:06:15.410]And so if we can draw from learning from these check blots,
[00:06:18.320]if we draw from this and adapt,
[00:06:21.380]the technologies were built elsewhere using site-specific
[00:06:25.380]meaning that field information, and then we do that much
[00:06:29.880]better job, and I don't think there's a consultant out there
[00:06:32.610]that shouldn't have check strips in everything they do
[00:06:36.410]to show the value if you're a consultant that's value add,
[00:06:39.960]you can, it's a conversation you have with your growers.
[00:06:42.390]Like, see, here's the differences, I'll be honest,
[00:06:44.800]I screwed up here.
[00:06:45.690]I mean, you have to have those learning points and say,
[00:06:47.760]you know what, this is why I didn't get right.
[00:06:50.590]Or this is why it showed this difference in those check
[00:06:53.770]strips, the high reference, the population, the water,
[00:06:57.370]I think there's so much that we can do from those
[00:06:59.870]that they're just huge value.
[00:07:03.180]So thank you for saying that Jason,
[00:07:09.280]I can add to what Jason mentioned too,
[00:07:11.730]I really liked the part where he talked about just being
[00:07:14.760]able to observe in the field and having boots on the ground
[00:07:17.690]and really seeing what's going on there,
[00:07:19.880]I think if you can integrate that kind of personal
[00:07:24.970]monitoring of what's going on with the technology
[00:07:28.040]that you're using, I think there's been a buying,
[00:07:30.930]in the long run, I mean,
[00:07:31.900]if you can see it with your own eyes
[00:07:33.720]and, really get a feel and understanding personally with
[00:07:38.350]what's going on, that's, only gonna help in the long run.
[00:07:44.140]Thank you guys, so a question just came in
[00:07:47.250]and it is, is it practical yet to do variable rate nitrogen
[00:07:50.580]application through center pivots?
[00:07:59.260]We at our research farm in Colorado, we're in the process,
[00:08:03.650]hopefully of purchasing a variable rate,
[00:08:07.460]linear sprinkler to have the opportunity to look
[00:08:11.990]at answering some of those questions,
[00:08:15.010]variable rate water is definitely there,
[00:08:18.270]one of the main things that we're gonna be focusing on
[00:08:20.430]is making decisions, support systems for defining exactly
[00:08:27.020]how much water you want to go in one place or another,
[00:08:29.030]but nutrient application and nitrogen application.
[00:08:33.220]That's definitely part of it, but it's certainly,
[00:08:36.380]it's challenging because you have different ratios of mix
[00:08:39.340]if you wanna fertigate, it's very challenging to make
[00:08:45.570]that logistically work out with the current systems.
[00:08:49.320]I'm very curious to see what,
[00:08:51.300]the other guys have to say about that too.
[00:08:57.590]My, take right now is we're the technology is developing,
[00:09:02.500]so, we can do variable rate the new what's, the pivot,
[00:09:05.220]I love having the check strip in the field,
[00:09:08.170]and I'll say Jason, you have high, I like Lowe's too.
[00:09:10.700]The guys I work with on panhandle,
[00:09:12.410]I love for them to put out a zero check because they like
[00:09:15.670]300 pounds of nitrogen pre,
[00:09:18.820]and they really like 300 pounds or 200 pounds of anhydrous,
[00:09:21.650]so that zero tells me a lot when that shows up in V 10,
[00:09:26.120]in the non applied, that tells a lot.
[00:09:27.950]But having that in fertigating based upon visual differences
[00:09:31.240]really, really handy, but the cost of those
[00:09:34.000]irrigation systems and the maintenance of them does provide
[00:09:37.860]quite a bit of challenge, and I don't know the ROI,
[00:09:40.820]I know I can tell you ROI is a variable rate
[00:09:43.460]but comparing that to the actual systems,
[00:09:46.437]I'm a big fan of having something like a wide drop,
[00:09:49.310]so you have that sprayer go through there,
[00:09:50.840]but I know that's another whole different thing.
[00:09:56.210]I would say the answer to the practicality
[00:09:59.480]is how bad is the problem,
[00:10:02.568]if you have a super variable field or,
[00:10:05.760]we have one where the, soil type changes happened to align
[00:10:09.870]nicely with pied shapes.
[00:10:11.490]So if, that works, yeah, that's practical,
[00:10:16.750]and if you've got a severe enough problem,
[00:10:19.780]it may mean you have to over fertigate
[00:10:23.140]on the inside of a pie to make sure that you'd get enough
[00:10:28.130]on the outside of the pie or vice versa.
[00:10:30.470]But I mean, it's all relative to how severe the problem is.
[00:10:36.750]And let's just one more note,
[00:10:38.310]I mean, don't forget that you can,
[00:10:40.200]have precision applications at planting too.
[00:10:43.030]So, on a seasonal basis, at least you can,
[00:10:46.560]kind of get yourself part of the way there.
[00:10:49.970]Excellent, great points, why don't we take maybe
[00:10:53.550]a step back from that question,
[00:10:55.120]so you guys talked a lot about some of the different
[00:10:57.880]approaches and how we can manage fertility and nitrogen
[00:11:00.870]specifically, and with it being imagery or reflect in space.
[00:11:05.350]So if we remove the variable rate component,
[00:11:07.900]what kind of recommendations and approaches would a person
[00:11:10.550]wants to factor in with those technologies for fertigation?
[00:11:19.870]So, if we remove variable rate, my take is,
[00:11:21.900]and this is something I've been hearing in regards
[00:11:24.970]to the crop is how we were doing a sorghum,
[00:11:27.820]Darren we've done it in the test program
[00:11:30.970]in Oklahoma is I really want, and I'm echoing Jason.
[00:11:35.880]I'm really wanting to delay my nitrogen until I know more
[00:11:40.390]whether that's weather, soil, crop, stain, whatever.
[00:11:44.150]And so my big push in all crops,
[00:11:46.570]that's wheat remove the grazing that's wheat
[00:11:50.080]that's sorghum, that's corn, is I want to find ways to move
[00:11:54.660]from a pre-plant application to an end season application
[00:11:58.190]and move that in season as close as possible
[00:12:01.090]to the greatest point of demand.
[00:12:02.350]So in wheat that's about Hollister
[00:12:04.000]and more, the demand really cranks up and sorghum and corn.
[00:12:07.620]You're getting that V six to V 10 stage where everything's
[00:12:10.640]really starting to blow up and expansive moving that,
[00:12:13.167]and so, anything you can do for me to shift
[00:12:16.000]from the pre-plant to an end season,
[00:12:18.010]I know that preplan is typically cheaper.
[00:12:20.100]It's typically already an application.
[00:12:22.550]That's why I like it lets us to make it has as more
[00:12:25.610]opportunity to make decisions, if you put 200 pounds out,
[00:12:29.070]pre-plant on the irrigated corn,
[00:12:30.870]how much are you really playing with in season?
[00:12:40.640]Daran I'd say that, I mean,
[00:12:43.070]we have have a handful of customers and friends
[00:12:47.290]that are not verbal written nitrogen, but they still use,
[00:12:51.790]like a high register where they made with a Coulter machine,
[00:12:54.450]and then they'll come over the top of that
[00:12:56.917]and fertigate all all season.
[00:12:59.650]And you can be very low tech,
[00:13:01.930]if you're out walking around and looking around,
[00:13:03.920]you can see that high rate strip and what the rest
[00:13:08.230]of the field is at and help you determine the timing
[00:13:10.540]of when things need to be happening.
[00:13:12.430]And it does not have to be high,
[00:13:14.500]tech to use the same principles.
[00:13:18.070]Very good point.
[00:13:21.800]I really don't have anything to add to what Daran
[00:13:24.137]and Jason said they qualified on that on a nutrient
[00:13:28.760]aspect that I wouldn't be..
[00:13:31.190]I'd like to throw something and I'll jump in real quick
[00:13:33.270]what Kendall said, and I think I've been reading some stuff
[00:13:35.550]on it that right now we have a tendency to one easy button
[00:13:39.200]that we use imagery and just push go,
[00:13:41.950]or we use a central just push go.
[00:13:44.230]I am a firm and absolute believer in boots on the ground,
[00:13:47.070]and it's been said by both of these guys where,
[00:13:49.170]you know what, I can use a high reference strip,
[00:13:51.200]and next to it, and look at the candid people low
[00:13:53.100]and look at those lower leaves and tell a whole lot about
[00:13:56.050]what's going on, but it takes me to walk out
[00:13:58.017]and look at it and we can do nitrogen okay,
[00:14:02.270]with an easy button, but if we wanna do nitrogen
[00:14:04.560]and water well, there's not really an easy button
[00:14:07.670]to do it really well.
[00:14:08.900]It takes effort, and it takes a person being out there.
[00:14:14.050]Very good point.
[00:14:15.860]So kind of more of a directed question.
[00:14:18.330]So Kendall I've met out at your location and you guys
[00:14:22.160]are doing some pretty cutting edge stuff in terms of how we
[00:14:24.450]manage water and how we think about systems
[00:14:27.170]and some of the technology that can interface with those
[00:14:29.810]systems, some of the stuff that you guys are playing around
[00:14:33.010]with for some growers or even some other researchers look
[00:14:36.680]very futuristic, how do you see the development
[00:14:39.830]of those tools and the commercialization so that it can
[00:14:42.940]nicely fit into say an app growers,
[00:14:46.490]operations, such as Jason's.
[00:14:50.310]Yeah, that's a great question and it's from a practical,
[00:14:54.330]short term sense alot of the things that we're looking
[00:14:56.920]at really seem beyond the scope of current capabilities.
[00:15:01.940]A lot of times we might get farmers that say,
[00:15:06.118]I, don't have a UAV or I'm not gonna be using
[00:15:09.230]remote sensing data or that sort of thing.
[00:15:13.510]I think it's good to stay ahead of the science
[00:15:15.470]and to look forward to what might be a possibility
[00:15:19.900]and what we've seen, over the last 10, 20 years is the UAV
[00:15:24.630]technology is remote sensing technologies, thermal imaging.
[00:15:28.850]All of those things have really come along with
[00:15:32.190]higher resolution, cheaper, more robust sensing platforms,
[00:15:38.880]and so, just like the computer as time goes on,
[00:15:42.930]we get more capabilities with, less cost.
[00:15:46.227]And, so we think it's worth,
[00:15:48.310]looking into the more we can learn,
[00:15:52.090]maybe that can help guide decisions.
[00:15:55.440]My opinion right now is that
[00:15:57.198]it's actually very easy to collect data.
[00:16:00.600]We have data overload,
[00:16:02.320]we are sitting on mountains of data right now.
[00:16:05.890]The challenge is really taking that data and turning it into
[00:16:09.700]a decision that we can inform a producer's management
[00:16:13.450]decision and really provide that link,
[00:16:17.150]just like we have all these remote sensing platforms
[00:16:21.340]and they also have variable rate irrigation systems.
[00:16:23.900]And like, we're just talking, how do you,
[00:16:26.200]provide that linkage and inform that decision?
[00:16:28.870]So, even though it seems far reaching,
[00:16:32.530]we really feel like it's not that far removed,
[00:16:35.690]and if manufacturers can get the buy in to,
[00:16:39.410]and if we can make that linkage,
[00:16:42.040]some of those things hopefully can happen behind the scenes
[00:16:45.260]and kind of help inform some decisions where,
[00:16:49.400]your farmer might not need to be a computer program
[00:16:52.340]or something like that, but it still could be, again,
[00:16:55.100]one of the tools that can help you make the decisions.
[00:16:57.540]It's not gonna farm for you,
[00:16:59.790]but it can be something that helps you in the long run.
[00:17:03.770]Excellent, very good point.
[00:17:05.790]So we only have a couple of minutes left before we have
[00:17:07.810]to move over to the other zoom link.
[00:17:09.760]So I guess I wanna say thank you gentlemen, for everything.
[00:17:15.000]If you guys wanna take just a couple other few seconds
[00:17:18.120]to maybe make a couple comments to some of the growers
[00:17:20.530]or anything you wanna share with them,
[00:17:22.930]please feel free to do so.
[00:17:26.913]Would just say, feel free to reach out
[00:17:28.000]and ask me any questions or give me grief.
[00:17:32.990]I just like to say thanks to Chuck for putting
[00:17:35.310]this together it takes a lot of work
[00:17:37.890]to put all of this together virtually
[00:17:40.230]and it's gone very well, so thanks to Chuck and everybody
[00:17:44.040]at UNL, you guys have done a great job.
[00:17:47.700]I'll maybe close with..
[00:17:50.040]I'd like to say thanks to the extension groups that try
[00:17:54.620]this stuff out before we go commercial with it,
[00:17:57.620]we use the Oklahoma State Algorithms,
[00:17:59.850]we use the Moderkshave was in Northward
[00:18:04.140]he was a tremendous resource
[00:18:05.330]that help us get this off the ground.
[00:18:07.590]So thanks to the extension groups to take the time
[00:18:10.120]and the energy and the money
[00:18:12.917]to really research this stuff before we try
[00:18:16.690]and go commercial with it.
[00:18:20.540]Thank you guys again, please go ahead,
[00:18:22.730]just down at the bottom,
[00:18:24.080]there's the link that crystal posted to everybody.
[00:18:26.820]So with that click on that,
[00:18:28.500]and we'll close out this session.

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Using Technology in Water & Nitrogen Management Question and Answer Session

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